The Bouncebackability Podcast
How to thrive not just survive in challenging times. Hosts Simon Ursell and Rusty Earnshaw talk to the change makers, leaders and mavericks in sport, business and beyond about what happens when we’re faced with tough challenges - and how to use these situations to challenge our thinking, resulting in more productive and rewarding outcomes.
Together with their guests, they’ll share their experiences and unpack how they have reacted to their biggest challenges, covering some enlightening topics such as:
👉 How the brain works when you are put under stress.
👉 How to get focused in a flow state to make good decisions.
👉 What people who thrive under stress think and do – and more.
Remember to like, subscribe or follow so you're notified of new episodes, and if you're keen to reach Rusty or Simon with any suggestions, feedback or comments, you can contact them via the show's LinkedIn page here:
https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-bouncebackability-podcast/
We hope you enjoy the show!
The Bouncebackability Podcast
Highlights of 2024 with Simon and Rusty | Episode 22
In today’s episode, Simon and Rusty take a heartfelt look back at the incredible interviews of 2024, highlighting the key takeaways, lightbulb moments, and powerful stories that moved and motivated them and the listeners. Together, they review the 10 transformative conversations that have challenged their perspectives on resilience and redefined what it means to embody bouncebackability in life’s toughest moments.
If you have a suggestion for a topic or guest for 2025, we want to hear from you! Message us via https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-bouncebackability-podcast/ with your suggestions.
The conversations from this series:
The King of Kent Mike Haynes Discusses Broking, Coaching, and Resilience | Episode 18
The Unseen Effort: Heather Fisher on Resilience, Authenticity, and Finding Purpose | Episode 16
Inside the World of Professional Rugby: Rich Bryan on Transition and Resilience | Episode 13
In this episode
00:00 Welcome - humbling and enlightening podcast feedback
14:49 How interpersonal disconnect and identity loss impacts relationships.
19:10 Using play to enhance communication and engagement skills.
24:08 How being versatile, resilient, and adaptive is essential in life's uncertainty.
28:01 How to embrace gratitude and have perspective.
31:58 Investing wisely in enhancing team brain skills.
33:58 City jobs - detrimental to mental health?
39:50 Disconnection and identity crisis among pro gamers.
Please like, subscribe or follow, so you're notified of any new episodes coming up, and if you're keen to reach Rusty or Simon with any suggestions, feedback or comments, you can contact them via the show's LinkedIn page here:
https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-bouncebackability-podcast/
Simon Ursell [00:00:00]:
Simon and Rusty here with the bounce back ability podcast. The podcast that explores how to deal with obstacles, setbacks, and challenges.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:00:07]:
Hope you enjoy the pod.
Simon Ursell [00:00:08]:
Looking forward to it. Listen on. Right. Welcome to the bounce back ability podcast, everybody. It is our review of the year. So I'm sat here in Rusty's kitchen with a nice cup of tea that he's made me, when we're gonna talk about all the amazing people that we've seen in 2024, and I cannot believe that some of these podcasts were this year. Sorry. Last year.
Simon Ursell [00:00:34]:
This is going this is going in January, isn't it? So we're time traveling.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:00:38]:
Yeah. How many days were there in 2024 this year? It was, like, 700 days or something?
Simon Ursell [00:00:41]:
I think it was 5,000, I don't think. I mean, it's genuinely crazy how many days there were.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:00:48]:
I've really enjoyed like, I've been looking back generally over 2024 and looking at stuff I've done, and then I just obviously in preparation for this way more prepared than you, noted
Simon Ursell [00:00:57]:
to listen. You you definitely are, Bob.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:00:59]:
I I went back and had a a look out and listened to some of the pods and some of my favorite bits from them and I was like we were in Windsor with James Rutter in 2024.
Simon Ursell [00:01:10]:
I know. I mean that that's wrong. It cannot be right. There must be some sort of weird time warp going on. How are we with James? I mean, imagine if we spoke to James he wouldn't be able to believe that it was
Rusty Earnshaw [00:01:21]:
2024. Yeah. Maybe he's still trapped in the room that we,
Simon Ursell [00:01:23]:
have Did we record it in in in, like, December 23 or something?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:01:30]:
Maybe it's, maybe maybe it was December 22.
Simon Ursell [00:01:33]:
I don't think you did.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:01:34]:
Maybe it was 21. It was a long time ago anyway. Anyway, look it's, it was really good to listen through. There was a lot a lot of action, a lot of really different, podcasts and experiences and stuff that I definitely took from it. I know I I just put something out on LinkedIn today where I just like, I'm loving doing the podcast because I'm just learning loads from it.
Simon Ursell [00:01:56]:
Yeah. I mean, me too. And, you know, huge gratitude to the people coming on because we're pretty lucky, aren't we, having a time with these guys?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:02:05]:
Yeah. And, like, and maybe the the the, you know, the Dave Colman one was, like, mind blowing and and just our ability to share and be vulnerable and, yeah, just, I guess, give tips to help other people with bouncing back as well.
Simon Ursell [00:02:22]:
And hopefully, by listening to the pod, people get a little bit of that as well and that, you know, they get to have some experience from from these incredible people,
Rusty Earnshaw [00:02:32]:
through us. Well, you you know that I send you lots of messages from people about the pond. Yeah. So I get loads of, traffic on my, WhatsApp.
Simon Ursell [00:02:39]:
Yeah. You get all of me. Everybody maybe sends me any messages, but that's not true. They do.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:02:43]:
That's why I send you them just to Yeah. I do. I don't know who side you are about it.
Simon Ursell [00:02:48]:
I get a few, but not as many as you, but it is nice. I mean, I I just think it's, it's fairly what's the word? Humbling. You know? Because you do you do, but you bowl around in your own little world, don't you? Believe in your own press sometimes. I don't know if you do, but I do. And then and then you meet these people and you say, oh, yeah. Wow. I mean, I've got a lot to learn. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:03:09]:
Lots to learn.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:03:10]:
Wait. Where should we start? Which where do you
Simon Ursell [00:03:11]:
want to start?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:03:11]:
Let's just
Simon Ursell [00:03:12]:
let's be chronological, shall we? So let's start with James, and, yeah, Cook.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:03:18]:
The king of Cook. He's been on a few retreats this year. Obviously, I see him most days because he's part of the Boaty Boys and
Simon Ursell [00:03:25]:
Yeah. Yeah. It was we explained the Boaty Boys, but I don't think he talked about that on the pod.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:03:29]:
Yeah. And so yeah. Well, look. We've, we do get together 6:30 every morning, do a HIIT session. We're actually meeting in London on Thursday which would be pretty cool, and it's really just around middle aged men who should know better doing exercise, keeping fit, checking in with one another. I I guess lots of the stuff we've spoken about. One of the things he spoke about with Cook was the importance of gatherings, of getting together, and if you, follow, Ruts on LinkedIn you'll see that they do lots of gatherings at Cook and getting people together, and I guess the Bodie Boys is our version of that.
Simon Ursell [00:04:04]:
Yeah. And and I guess that's a that's a theme that's gone through all of our pods right away from the start. Community, environment, having a community of people around you is massive for your resilience.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:04:16]:
Yeah. Resilience by community is a phrase I heard and I loved, and, you've done well not to bring Mustafa in at this point. I know, obviously, it'll happen at some point later. Well, you
Simon Ursell [00:04:25]:
bought him up already, so I'm blaming you. So
Rusty Earnshaw [00:04:29]:
but yeah. No. That was, you know, that was my probably my big take home from from RUTS was just like the importance of that. And again, there's there's stuff they're doing with prisoners and trying to help them transition back into, I guess, relatively normal life is like, incredible as well. I guess some of the transitions we have in life are often the bits where we need the most resilience. I know we're gonna speak a bit later about, you know, Rich Brian and and and that, but actually the tran the transition from being a professional rugby player into the rest of your life is an important thing. And I guess with RUTS, I think they're navigating that beautifully with some of the work they do and employment opportunities they're creating to, allow people to transition back to.
Simon Ursell [00:05:18]:
Yeah. And beautiful is the word, I think. I mean, you've got prisoners, people who've had some proper challenges in their lives. I mean, really, you know, maybe made some mistakes, maybe been put in places which were mistakes for them, and ended up in a really, really difficult place. And a beautiful thing to then allow redemption and let those guys, people come back into the community and find something that's positive and that they can really turn their lives around with is it is beautiful. I think it's a wonderful wonderful thing they're doing and very bouncy.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:05:53]:
Very bouncy. So that was January.
Simon Ursell [00:05:55]:
That was
Rusty Earnshaw [00:05:56]:
January. February, Luke docked Ian actually probably ended the year really well as well with we're gonna are you gonna get his name right?
Simon Ursell [00:06:03]:
Kareem.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:06:04]:
Kareem?
Simon Ursell [00:06:05]:
Kareem. Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:06:05]:
So obviously the 2 of them and, just flexing the mind muscle, I guess.
Simon Ursell [00:06:11]:
Yeah. Well, I I mean, I know Karim and Luke really well, through Mindful People Performance and, I'm a yeah. They they've they've impacted a lot of people I know in amazing ways and a lot of people, you know, especially the Tyler Grange guys. Yeah. They there's a lot of work going on with them and the effect on resilience is startling actually. And I mean, if you wanna talk about money, business wise, you know, talk about performance, high performance in business. We've just seen some sensational performance from people that have been working with them because they've become much more bouncy, much more aware of themselves and what they are good and not so good at. And it's it just gives people confidence and all the rest of it.
Simon Ursell [00:06:56]:
I mean, you know, Luke is a is a is an incredibly impressive guy. And I actually went to his, BAM, boxing and mindfulness session in the east end of London, with a whole load of community guys working there. And, yeah, that was that was very emotional, the work that they're doing, changing lives there. So, again, you know, somebody who's really, really helping support people in difficult circumstances, you do mindfulness.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:07:27]:
And and for those kind of people that are interested in like the numbers and the bottom line and all that type of stuff, the work they're doing in TGE, are you are you seeing reduced absenteeism, increased productivity, better people working, get understanding how to get the best out of themselves.
Simon Ursell [00:07:46]:
Yeah. And others. And, you know, being able to just it just gives you extra ability to cope. I mean, it's, in terms of bounce back ability, I think mindfulness, mindful practice. I mean, neither you you and I don't like the the word mindfulness, do we? I mean, I don't,
Rusty Earnshaw [00:08:00]:
That's why I use the word mind muscle. Mind muscle.
Simon Ursell [00:08:03]:
Very good. Yes. You like flow state, Tony, which I've been using. Flow. Yeah. I've I've stolen that. And that that is, I guess, Luke and Karim would definitely call that mindfulness. And I don't they they don't particularly like the word.
Simon Ursell [00:08:13]:
Karim was telling us that that word comes from it's it's been lifted out of the bible or something, isn't it? And it was used, just as a sort of shorthand, but it stuck. I mean, I don't mind it, but I think I think there's a lot of associations with that now. I'd rather use flow state, high performance, those kind of things, because I think it speaks to more people.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:08:32]:
And maybe an interesting, one for you to think about is, like, as more people follow, I guess, the TG lead and go to the 4 day week, do you think this is an essential part of that? Because clearly as you move from 5 days to 4 days, you're probably gonna have to get the best out of yourself, understand how to do deep work, be focused, also be able to recover really well, you know, to rest the mind at certain times as well as to be like on it at others. Do you think it's like almost going to be something that sits alongside that transition?
Simon Ursell [00:09:05]:
Well, if you wanna do it really well. Yeah. I mean, you can I mean, you don't have you wouldn't have to do it, but it's hard? 4 day week is a difficult thing to do. It's not an easy thing to do at all. Sounds great, but it's not as difficult, wonderful to do. But I'd I'd say the sort of work we've done around mental health, Suzanne Brown obviously works in our the psychologist works in our business quite a bit alongside Luke and others, really supporting the team's mental health, building resilience, and helping them be bouncy. But, yeah, I mean, our our absentee, we've we've gone from a couple of days a year on average to less than 1, which is might not sound a lot, but those those of us running companies, although that is enormous, and you can't put that down to just luck or something because all those stats everywhere else across the economy in the UK are going the other way Going
Rusty Earnshaw [00:09:57]:
the other way. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:09:58]:
And in Tully Green is coming down the other way. And that's despite it being unbelievably busy and stressful at Tully Green.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:10:03]:
Nice. And a shout out to Suzanne Brown, previous guest on the pod, and, currently moving from Suzanne 2.0 to Suzanne 3.0, talking today to me about telepathy.
Simon Ursell [00:10:13]:
So Was she talking today?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:10:14]:
Yeah. She's way, was she? She's on it. Oh, lovely. So good. So good. Yeah. And then we and then we she
Simon Ursell [00:10:21]:
You can't just say that and leave that hanging. What do what do you mean telepathy?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:10:25]:
I just nodded politely.
Simon Ursell [00:10:27]:
Did you?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:10:28]:
Don't tell her.
Simon Ursell [00:10:29]:
Don't tell her. Okay. I won't tell her. No.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:10:31]:
Then in March we spoke to my best mate, Rich B, Richie Brian in the Bristol offices. One of the best humans I know about pro sport. And I was just saying to you then, I think it's become even more it's really interesting. There's, now as we speak there's a program just come out about the 2003 World Cup winning squad, and what they've been through since then, and lots of them saying it was a curse, and the experiences they've had, and the mental health issues, and all kinds of other things. And then similarly there are a few of them I just listened to, Phil Vickery and, Ben Cohen doing a podcast for The Good, The Bad and the Rugby, which again was, yeah, pretty eye opening to be honest. And it just took me back a bit, we we were there and they spoke about being the guinea pigs for rugby and, you know Ben Cohen's dad had been murdered at when he was 21, and actually none of them had ever spoken about it. And this kind of just made me think a lot about I think I referenced it on the point, I said I wondered whether we were medicating with the alcohol, but just this kind of macho environment where people didn't speak about feelings, where we didn't like really probably understand one another. I just wondered, you know, again it seems like there's there's definitely been some, yeah, some eggs broken along the way.
Simon Ursell [00:11:59]:
Well, it's fascinating. I mean, listen to the rich part. I mean, he is real I mean, related to that, I think there's a lot in there that it shouldn't be a surprise, really. I mean, if you think about it, I mean, you say, you know, medicating with alcohol, you know, you I I remember you talking about Bath United in the pop cuts, but is it Bath United?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:12:19]:
Bath United. Yeah. Lambert.
Simon Ursell [00:12:20]:
Yeah. Thank you.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:12:21]:
Lam well, actually, Lambbridge United because we trained at Lambbridge and so we we named ourselves Lambbridge United.
Simon Ursell [00:12:27]:
But that was a lot of partying, a lot of fun, having a great time, and a lot of community there. Yeah. But was it a little avoidant of some of this stuff maybe?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:12:34]:
Well, then we weren't all at the party, were we? So they they some of the people that weren't in Lambbridge United weren't invited.
Simon Ursell [00:12:40]:
Well, they were they all wanted to come in, didn't they? They kept Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:12:42]:
They wanted to come in in the end. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:12:44]:
Yeah. So it's a I think it's fascinating. I mean, the whole thing around, I mean, you know, again, a theme around prosport. Not a huge fan of prosport, but I do I do understand it and and it's, you know, there is some sort of need for that, but I I don't think any of us are that I mean, you shouldn't be that surprised that the 2,003 guys have come out and said it was hard really, I suppose. I mean, given the sort of history of, you know, man up, son, and get on with it. And then, you know, we're talking I I mean, that just reminds me, was it who was talking about manning up?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:13:20]:
There was a 1000000 people at the parade in London.
Simon Ursell [00:13:24]:
Were there?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:13:25]:
Yeah. Like it's almost before social, so they're like videoing it on a camcorder. Yeah. And like
Simon Ursell [00:13:32]:
A million?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:13:32]:
They were like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like hanging for it was definitely for health and safety. There was people hanging from buildings. But like that judgment thing that, like, the the lenses on you, that was probably, I guess, just the start of that. And now it's, like, even more magnified, isn't it?
Simon Ursell [00:13:51]:
Yeah. I mean I mean, in some ways, better cared for and insulated from the fame. In other ways, not helped at all with the sort of well, especially once you've finished, once you're no longer valued Required. Yeah. Then, you know, it's pretty much here's a few things that we've put in place, but it's lip service and see you later. And you can end up on the scrap peep fast. And the majority of pro sports people are on the scrap peep very fast and not cared for at all. I mean, that's one of the wonderful things about Rich, and what he does is he spends a lot of time helping those that nobody else will.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:14:30]:
So Yeah. He's pretty good at that, Rich. He'd be that'd be pretty important to him. And I guess that's what lots of the 2003 team were speaking about was actually how can we kind of pay it forward and help others, and it'd be interesting to see where that goes.
Simon Ursell [00:14:42]:
What's what's less and less and less than from that? What would you what would I mean, you know, this is about bounce back ability, not about falling down and not getting Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:14:49]:
I think there's a few things in it, isn't there? It was interesting again how they just didn't really probably understand each other, how they hadn't stayed connected afterwards. There was definitely a lot of conversations around loss of identity. That sometimes seems like it played out into, like, marriages as well of sometimes actually the partner might have struggled with the loss of identity. Actually, my life's changed from this and that money and to actually, like, it's it's now a really different life. And so I guess, well, what did I what did I think about? I thought it sounded really individual. People have gone through some different stuff. There's obviously some some stuff around the concussion as well which, has clearly had impact upon some people as well. So yeah, I guess.
Simon Ursell [00:15:35]:
That's a key thing, isn't it? Individual.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:15:38]:
Yeah. It's really individual.
Simon Ursell [00:15:39]:
Really individual. You know, resilience is individual. You know, you there is no magic wand. You couldn't you can't say, oh, follow this program and you will be resilient. Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:15:47]:
And stuff that would have made people I was just fascinating listening to people speak about some of the stuff that makes you resilient. So I was a professional player, but I've got a masters from Cambridge. So that kind of almost I've got some resilience in my system though, haven't I, that if all else fails in the rugby, then someone might give me a job.
Simon Ursell [00:16:08]:
Please give someone a job.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:16:10]:
Yeah. But people said look, this was the we were the we were the guinea pigs really. Like, we we we hadn't gone to university. We left school straight away. And again, I think that's a bit more mitigated now in sport, but Do you? It's it's a bit more mitigated. I know. I feel like
Simon Ursell [00:16:27]:
kids going into prosport whose education is definitely not a priority.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:16:31]:
Yeah. Yeah. Interestingly, I was at a football a Premier League football club the other day and they were talking they've got an 18 year old lad, 17 year old lad, actually, is playing in the first team and being offered astronomical, sums of money. And the parents, one of whom is a lawyer, one of whom's a doctor, just said he won't be signing that contract unless he's allowed to do a levels. And I thought bravo, well done you.
Simon Ursell [00:16:52]:
Oh, yeah. I wanna shake those
Rusty Earnshaw [00:16:55]:
pants. Yeah. That's awesome. So I guess yeah. Look, well, Again, I think it's individual and, you know, I my experience around rugby is that it's better in some places than others. But the reality was like people were yeah. They just that that bit of resilience that could have been in the system from qualifications or a trade or whatever it might be was missing and that and that did lead to some problems.
Simon Ursell [00:17:21]:
Plus, you know, if if community makes you resilient, suddenly that community just vanishes literally overnight, you're no longer in that community, then that's gonna be pretty pretty breaking for your resilience, isn't it?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:17:33]:
Yeah. That's what the RPA do, isn't it? Like, alumni and and, you know, that they help support you when when those things happen.
Simon Ursell [00:17:40]:
Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. For sure. And just, you know, to maybe make things a little bit lighter, we then had, or maybe more serious, Matt and Adam came in from
Rusty Earnshaw [00:17:51]:
Really light apart from the one quote of the opposite of player's depression.
Simon Ursell [00:17:55]:
Yeah. That's not so light. That's true.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:17:57]:
Less light.
Simon Ursell [00:17:58]:
That's not so light. Yeah. Well, the the the quote is actually the opposite of play isn't work, the the opposite of play is depression, isn't it? It's really just to illustrate that play is actually a necessary thing that all humans, adults, everybody needs to to work on is is playfulness. Another thing Tyler Grange has been really experimenting with this year.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:18:24]:
Yeah. And I think you'd said, like, some people have taken to it like ducks to water and other people have found it a little bit more challenging. But yeah. I mean It's
Simon Ursell [00:18:32]:
individual again though because, I mean, the the great thing is because at Tiley Crane being Tiley Crane, play means play, so we're screwing around for
Rusty Earnshaw [00:18:39]:
a year Yeah. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:18:41]:
And doing silly things. And that for some that's not playful for everybody. That can be, say, one of the things we've really learned is they try and you know, it's not about getting a game out and playing a game. You can just be playful around seriousness and just make things a little bit more lighthearted and enjoyable and connecting and human. Playfulness doesn't mean silliness, I think, is something that we really learned. And and they did speak about on the pod actually.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:19:07]:
Yeah. I think it was like Play
Simon Ursell [00:19:09]:
is a serious business.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:19:10]:
Yeah. Some real practical examples of how you can take play and, you know, the Elmo and the and the Grover are really good examples, and how you can use that for example to level a room and allow people who may not normally speak to speak, and probably people like me and you to shut up and speak less and probably ask better questions. Yeah. So yeah, look, I I again for me it's the yeah They had some great practical examples of how you could take that into your your day to day work.
Simon Ursell [00:19:38]:
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, if if you ever get a chance to go to Exeter Business School and see the play lab, the built there's a purpose built building they have built, to enable playfulness. It's really, really eye opening. I took a lot of photos. They let there's a book that costs about a £1,000,000 to buy because it's had a it's ridiculously expensive because it's had a print, I think, that I can't get hold of, but they they used it to design their play lab.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:20:03]:
Oh, wow.
Simon Ursell [00:20:04]:
It's it's really, really fascinating stuff. I met a guy who I really wanna get on the pod actually who is a, I don't know what his job title is, but he creates high performance environments, mainly in the Premier League. So he he takes, environments and makes them more high performing. So he's he's very much looking at these kinds of things. Does he Oh,
Rusty Earnshaw [00:20:27]:
well, there we go. We'll have to get him on in 2025, which is approximately 500 days away if 2024 continues in this place.
Simon Ursell [00:20:36]:
That's so true. So true. But they were great. I mean, that I I think play is something I mean, listen to the pod because it is a great pod. There's a whole lot in there, especially if you've got an interest in this stuff. But again, if you're interested in high performance and you wanna relate this to £0.1, shillings, or pence, those kinds of things, you know, supporting people and helping them feel safe is really important, but also creating an environment that support playful, that allows people to be put at ease, relaxed. You're taking away a lot of the risk when you use play. It's very accessible.
Simon Ursell [00:21:09]:
It allows the most junior or most threatened people to feel less threatened. You're gonna get a far higher, output if, that's your priority. So, you know, if we're gonna be merciful about it, use play because you'll make more money.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:21:26]:
Yeah. I mean and, yeah, and again, the language experimentation, the type of thing, you know, the 4 day week probably started as an experiment. You probably went conversation. Yeah. Like, some playful convos and let's try it for a few weeks. Let's see how it goes.
Simon Ursell [00:21:40]:
Oh, Yeah. What does that mean?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:21:42]:
There's no way we'll keep doing this.
Simon Ursell [00:21:44]:
Right. So let's just kinda let have a joke with it.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:21:46]:
Yeah. And that's it. Exactly that, isn't it? Like, some serious stuff has come out of that, but it didn't start off with a, okay, let's do a let's do the 5 year strategy on the 4 day week. It started out as playful experimentation.
Simon Ursell [00:21:58]:
Definitely. Definitely, something we were just throwing around.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:22:02]:
And you actually played around with what day of the week it was and would it be everyone? And actually, it wasn't
Simon Ursell [00:22:06]:
Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:22:07]:
The thing that it necessarily became. It just it was just some slightly different iterations of the experiment. You threw a bit of sodium in the water, the lab exploded. You changed you you you put some, safety goggles on after that.
Simon Ursell [00:22:19]:
Yeah. After the lab, it exploded. Yep. Safety goggles went on then. Yep. Helpful. Well, we Yeah. I mean, we did I I actually wanted to do the Wednesday off on the 4 day week.
Simon Ursell [00:22:28]:
I really wanted to do the Wednesday off.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:22:30]:
By the way, I love the idea of Wednesday off because it means you only work 2 days in the road map.
Simon Ursell [00:22:33]:
That's exactly what I was going 2 days a weekend, 2 days a weekend, 2 days a weekend. How amazing is that? Yeah. But it absolutely
Rusty Earnshaw [00:22:41]:
Does it work?
Simon Ursell [00:22:41]:
Well, we didn't we didn't we ended up not trying it, which is a shame, isn't it, really? We never got to that experiment because it worked so damn well having Friday off that we were all like, nobody wants to experiment because we're just loving, having
Rusty Earnshaw [00:22:56]:
Yeah. I do get I do get Friday. Maybe it should be a 3 day week, and it's Wednesday and
Simon Ursell [00:23:02]:
Friday off. You're starting to get to the to the sort of total muppet show, mad experiment stage when he's talking about 3 day weeks. But I but I don't know
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:10]:
3 day week, I work till 8 PM.
Simon Ursell [00:23:13]:
Yeah. That's not a 3 day week, though. I mean, what we're talking about here is reduced hours. Know it. That's yeah. That's dangerous.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:18]:
Well, I'm currently trialing the 7 I'm currently trialing this 7 day with you.
Simon Ursell [00:23:21]:
Yeah. Well done. How's that going for you?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:24]:
Badly. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:23:25]:
Yeah. Yeah. It would.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:26]:
Can't wait for Christmas.
Simon Ursell [00:23:28]:
Yep. Yep. Well, yeah, Christmas will go fast because that's the bit that goes quick, isn't it? Everything else goes slow.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:33]:
Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:23:34]:
So, yeah, that And then Heather Fisher.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:36]:
Oh, Heather. Delighted us in, in the Birmingham office.
Simon Ursell [00:23:39]:
Yeah. I mean, that was the least I spoke of all podcasts, by a country mile because, yeah, she Wonderful. Well, because she's amazing, isn't she?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:48]:
I love her.
Simon Ursell [00:23:49]:
Yeah. Yep. I'm
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:51]:
And you know
Simon Ursell [00:23:51]:
I get her. I've only met her twice, and I I think she's incredible.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:23:54]:
Yeah. And it's been cool for me. I've checked in with her and spoken to her loads since,
Simon Ursell [00:23:59]:
How's the scooter? I mean, she get is she a professional scooter racer now? I don't think the international
Rusty Earnshaw [00:24:03]:
I don't think the international scooter racing has kicked off just yet.
Simon Ursell [00:24:07]:
But that
Rusty Earnshaw [00:24:08]:
would be really fishy. And I do love that about her that there's there's just so many kind of strands and options and things going on which again like all the stuff she spoke around around, her band's spec ability probably gets really challenged by that. I think like there's there's lots of options that could exist in her life, it's not that organised, it's not that certain, and so she's moving around a lot. So that ability to go, how do I get the best out of myself? How do I deal with the setbacks? And clearly like in the industry she's in there will be setbacks.
Simon Ursell [00:24:43]:
She's had so many setbacks. I know. She doesn't massively care though, does she? She just well, she does really care, but it doesn't seem to stop her. She's she's just a she's just an absolute force of nature.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:24:54]:
She's tougher than me.
Simon Ursell [00:24:55]:
Yeah. Oh, yeah. She's definitely tougher than anybody. She's tougher
Rusty Earnshaw [00:24:58]:
than physically and mentally.
Simon Ursell [00:25:00]:
Pretty much everyone I've ever
Rusty Earnshaw [00:25:01]:
met. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:25:02]:
But, you know, that resilience is built out of challenge, isn't it?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:25:06]:
In Yeah. And again, you think about the stuff she did like SAS and all that. Yeah. She is she is like chasing challenges. I I talk a lot about, like, those karaoke moments where, you know, I I probably not that good at singing. But if you said, come on, Rusty, me and you, let's do Alan's in the stream, you'll obviously be dolly potted in that duet.
Simon Ursell [00:25:28]:
I I don't mind, buddy. I'm very comfortable.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:25:31]:
Then, like, I I would chase karaoke moments, like the little ones who
Simon Ursell [00:25:37]:
Is Alan's in the stream your karaoke son?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:25:40]:
Possibly. It's
Simon Ursell [00:25:40]:
it's definitely mine. Yeah. That's that. And, I always always
Rusty Earnshaw [00:25:43]:
have that. Well, I think fish is is just, like, even more extreme. Like, just chasing challenge the whole time actually, like, yeah. Just incredible. So, like, a, an incredible human, b, like some incredible stories about how she's, like, dealing with the challenges in front of her.
Simon Ursell [00:26:02]:
Yeah. And it was the most edited podcast as well, not just because we bounced around so much with different edited podcast as well. Not just because we bounced around so much with different stories and things, but just because, yeah, she's she is facing a lot of challenges and continues to.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:26:14]:
And says what she thinks. So that might have been why we edited a little
Simon Ursell [00:26:17]:
bit of the to edit some of the Yeah. She said what she thinks bits. But well, I mean, to be honest, it would have been lovely just to keep them in because I didn't I personally thought it was fine, but, yeah, she didn't wanna get into trouble, which is fair enough, isn't it really? Yeah. But, yeah, she was she was amazing. I'd, I'd I'd happily spent a lot of time with Fish. All a wonderful person. And then Kirsty and the Brit school
Rusty Earnshaw [00:26:41]:
Where did we film that? Can you remember?
Simon Ursell [00:26:43]:
I did. We were in London for that one. Beautiful. With with the TG team. So, she had a great time. We actually had a bit of a party. We had a bit of a party.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:26:51]:
Took her to a party. Like
Simon Ursell [00:26:52]:
I can't remember why we had a party, but then we have a lot of parties. But yeah. Yeah. Yep. She she just stayed on and came out and had a brilliant Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:00]:
Didn't she like didn't she go end up, like, staying with you for 3 nights and just going out and landed on the lash?
Simon Ursell [00:27:05]:
No. No. She didn't. No. But No.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:07]:
She didn't. No. She was she was welcomed into the TG team pretty quickly.
Simon Ursell [00:27:11]:
100%. Yeah. She was getting hugs and everything.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:13]:
Maybe our best dressed guest as well. Yeah. Well, coolest. The coolest dressed.
Simon Ursell [00:27:17]:
Yeah. I mean, yeah, she was the coolest dressed guest.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:20]:
Yeah. I
Simon Ursell [00:27:21]:
understand. I think Fish would probably Fish would be give her a run for her money.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:26]:
Rich Brian would be at least
Simon Ursell [00:27:27]:
Well, that's harsh if he's Ashes because he's your mate saying that. I would be the least best dressed. You'd probably
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:33]:
You're very similar to Rich. You you are wearing fashionable netwear.
Simon Ursell [00:27:37]:
No. I you you you've got some sort of problem with fashionable netwear. I think I look look absolutely charming.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:27:43]:
And I guess the stuff with Kirsty that really resonated for me was the community work they do. Yeah. And,
Simon Ursell [00:27:49]:
And she is continuing to do now. She's doing some pretty cool stuff. And if there are anybody out there listening who's got a few quid lying around, yeah, she's doing some great stuff, and there's an opportunity to help her.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:28:01]:
And for me, it's a little bit it's it's definitely like gratitude. It's probably a bit around perspective, and I think I just shared with you then, like, it really reminded me of, in, when did it go? September, October, I was in San Fran and met, went for dinner with, the Tongan Tiger who plays in the San Francisco 49ers, and he spoke about when he was 17. He'd met a mentor and the mentor had asked him to do 4 things and he said this is the reason I made it in the NFL. Number 1 was I get a full social media. It's not good for your brain. Yep. Yep. Makes sense.
Simon Ursell [00:28:37]:
Yeah. 100%.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:28:38]:
Telling me off for it. Second thing
Simon Ursell [00:28:40]:
is you off. I was giving you a
Rusty Earnshaw [00:28:42]:
A nudge.
Simon Ursell [00:28:42]:
A nudge.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:28:43]:
Yeah. Second thing was, every time we go to a new lecture, meet someone new. Yeah. So I love that. Yeah. Community. Connection, community. Third thing was, feed the homeless every week.
Simon Ursell [00:28:58]:
Wow. Humble. Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:28:59]:
Yeah. And then the 4th form was I want names and numbers of all the people that have helped you get to where you are in life now and it was 11 people and I want you to check-in with them every month for the rest of your life. So that was 7 years ago and he is continuing to do it.
Simon Ursell [00:29:14]:
Yeah. Wow.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:29:15]:
And again, that made me think about Kirsty and just, yeah, just that community thing and who's not only that community that she's trying to impact on a broader sense, but actually who is your community that's helping you be resilient.
Simon Ursell [00:29:27]:
Yeah. And and you've gotta I mean, that really speaks to nurturing it, doesn't it? And making sure that you, you know, you remain connected to that. That that that is very cool.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:29:37]:
That's definitely the right one.
Simon Ursell [00:29:38]:
Of the 11 people that I that I would put down.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:29:41]:
Yeah. Well, it just happened to be 11 for him. It might be more or less for you, and given our ages, it it possibly should be more. But I love the idea. Just nurture that community around you.
Simon Ursell [00:29:52]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:29:53]:
I actually went and saw one of my old rugby coaches recently and, and he will be one of one of my anchors.
Simon Ursell [00:29:58]:
I got you.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:30:00]:
I went and saw Pete back up in Stockton and then, incredibly, he'd gone up into his loft and, my I gave him my last image here from 95 and he said I think your son might want this now. That was pretty cool. So anyway I sent a picture to Fred and and Fred thinks oh no he loves it. Fred thinks on my old tops are like you know, the Contrader's ones are like really cool and retro now.
Simon Ursell [00:30:24]:
They are really cool and retro.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:30:25]:
Yeah. So he's got a few of them now. So anyway, so, no. Pete Armstrong legend. Wow. Shout out to Pete Armstrong. Gave, her yeah. Gave me the shirt back and I gave it to Fred.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:30:35]:
He's proudly wearing it around canvas in Bath.
Simon Ursell [00:30:38]:
Oh, mate. That's cool, Really cool. Yeah. That's a lovely look.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:30:42]:
And we sat for probably 2 hours and went through all the old programs and all the stuff he'd kept and, you know, we went to Old Old Woodians on a tour, he slob the receipt from the hotel, which hotels are pretty cheap back then. Yeah, it was just incredible like a real like amazing 2 hours of my of my 2024 really.
Simon Ursell [00:31:01]:
Oh, God. That's beautiful. Yeah. That's beautiful. What a lovely story. Wow. And that really is and, you know, that's what Kirsty was speaking to, wasn't it? That whole sense of community, that incredibly special place. You you you talk about the Brit School as being the best environment you've ever been to.
Simon Ursell [00:31:16]:
I love it. And I I mean, I've never been, but I can imagine.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:31:19]:
I would want my kids together.
Simon Ursell [00:31:21]:
Yeah. Sure.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:31:21]:
They would I think they would feel safe. They would belong. People would see, them for their strengths. There wouldn't be any bullying or anything like that. Yeah. Remarkable Place.
Simon Ursell [00:31:34]:
Well, they pay a lot of attention, don't they, to their to their, mental health growth, don't they? That that's what they're really, really trying to do hard. So again, if you wanna talk about high performance and if you wanna turn this into a way of achieving really amazing things, I mean, you look at the Brits score and you look at the names of the people that have been there, I mean, if you don't know, look them up. I mean Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:31:58]:
And in an industry that is very demanding, actually, like, yeah again just maybe people reflect upon the team they're part of or the business they're in, like if you could improve the brain skills of all the people in your team like what would the impact of that be? And I guess that's what they're thinking about by deaf you know, they don't have huge amounts of money from the government at the moment, but they are definitely investing it wisely into people who can help people with their brains.
Simon Ursell [00:32:25]:
Yeah. I mean, it plays my I mean, I've it's just a it's just blowing my mind that people aren't paying attention to this stuff and just are still insisting on, oh, it's a load of old nonsense.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:32:36]:
Yeah. But it doesn't like well, a) they might not understand it, but b) like, when I asked you about what does what does it do to the bottom line? Like, that's what people wanna know. And I don't think, you know, and it's hard to then go, oh, but it's entirely due to that. So people kind of want cause and effect a lot, don't they?
Simon Ursell [00:32:53]:
Well, I can I've got the numbers. Yeah. I mean, it is cause and effect. I mean, you can see it happening at Tigerange. I mean, it just has. Yeah. I mean, that's not why we did it though. And I think that's possibly the key, really is if I mean, if you want a successful business, pay attention to it for sure.
Simon Ursell [00:33:10]:
I think it's quite hard because you can't go and see an accountant and say, right, if you give me £1,000,000, I'm gonna invest it in this and I'm gonna see a return of £10,000,000 from it.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:33:20]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:33:20]:
Because you I just don't not sure how you could do that. I mean, you probably could come up with some numbers, but then, you know, you're gonna be really challenged. It's gonna make it stressful and kinda defeat the point. I think where you gotta come from is genuinely be interested about people and caring about people and want them to be the best they can be. And if that's what you want, then you can invest in this stuff happily without worrying too much about the bottom line. And lo and behold, you'll do really well.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:33:45]:
Well, let's talk about Mike Hanes and businesses that where the bottom line is really important. And split second decisions could cost you 1,000,000 and you are under the microscope.
Simon Ursell [00:33:58]:
Yeah. It's a troubling world, isn't it? Oh, so stressed. I mean, I I I find it really diff I mean, I find it hard to talk about the city and, finance because I know a lot of people in that world just because my background, a posh boy, went to boarding school. I know a lot of people that ended up working in the city. Me too. It's not ideal for your mental health as an environment because it's I mean, they they think a 40 hour week is lazy, don't they? They they would say an 80 hour week was pretty standard, 90 hour week where you're trying hard. You and I would probably point out that they're not gonna be performing at their best. That just because they're there doesn't mean they're doing anything or doing that well, and they're ending up pretty messed up.
Simon Ursell [00:34:41]:
I mean, relationships struggle. I mean, I I don't know what it's like in the city. I can't imagine many relationships survive it, intact.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:34:50]:
Yeah maybe it's the, maybe it's the business equivalent of professional sport.
Simon Ursell [00:34:55]:
Yeah. Yeah. 100%.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:34:56]:
Where there's
Simon Ursell [00:34:57]:
Big money.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:34:58]:
Big money, judgments, you can be have your desk cleared quite quickly and suddenly you're not there anymore. Yeah. Yeah. Suddenly, yeah. First in last out mindset. I I slept under my desk for 3 nights in a row type stuff and that's kind of a macho thing to say.
Simon Ursell [00:35:16]:
That's say true. Because I mean, I know a couple of guys I know, in fact, one in particular, lost his job in his late forties. It took him 3 years to get something else. Yeah. Awful. But again, educate with that. You know, you gotta support these kind of guys, somehow, but there's no support. It's like, yep.
Simon Ursell [00:35:37]:
You're gone. Goodbye. Well, no talking to you again.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:35:39]:
Yeah. And the fact that Mike's experienced that and he's trying to coach and help people in that, and I know me and Fletch made an attempt at it and it definitely wasn't as good as Mike's attempt at it is like it's cool isn't it that even in that world they're starting to maybe think differently about performance and bounce back ability and and people being at their best and perhaps like some of the cultural traditions may change, fingers crossed.
Simon Ursell [00:36:09]:
Yeah. It's it's it's funny though, isn't it? They almost use this stuff against it as well. So, yeah, I spoke to a psychologist, oh, god. I don't know. It was sometime this year, which was probably 800 days ago. And they were saying that they didn't wanna work within the city because psychologists were brought in just to basically get people wound up, fire them back out again. They're just just keeping them going. They weren't doing anything meaningful.
Simon Ursell [00:36:36]:
They were just they were just persuading them to carry on breaking themselves.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:36:41]:
Yeah. It's often not preventative as it is often, like, reactive.
Simon Ursell [00:36:44]:
Short term. Yeah. Yeah. Get them
Rusty Earnshaw [00:36:46]:
get them. Triage.
Simon Ursell [00:36:47]:
Well, they're just wringing every last drop out of people, and then when there's nothing more to give, they just sack them. Pretty grim. I mean
Rusty Earnshaw [00:36:56]:
Yeah. I'll be seeing some of my friends from the city on Thursday, and I'm already excited to hear some of their stories. Some of them are
Simon Ursell [00:37:03]:
Were the Boaty Boys?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:37:05]:
Some of the Boaty Boys were in the city. They definitely had a tough time. Yeah. Some of them definitely shouldn't still be working but I think it's like a drug or or
Simon Ursell [00:37:17]:
Well, I think they can't stop there, can they? I mean, my my experience is a lot of the guys can't stop because they're earning so much been earning so much money in order to maintain that. They gotta keep going. They can't they're so much frightened to become what they would see as poor, like you and me. They would see as pretty poor. And they'll and it but they they haven't really sort of
Rusty Earnshaw [00:37:36]:
They've got a bigger kitchen than mine. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's what you're saying.
Simon Ursell [00:37:40]:
They've got a bigger kitchen than both of us put together times 2 and probably somewhere in central London. So, yeah, definitely the square footage of their kitchen would definitely be bigger than ours. Yeah. But they're but I wouldn't say they're enjoying it.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:37:54]:
Yeah. And then we move to the other end of the spectrum. So talking about the Boaty Boys, late forties, early fifties. We've got the kind of cousins. So you're a bit of a fanboy off, to be honest. Yeah. You're slightly awkward. Well Working with younger people who are like gamers, and so suddenly you're actually talking about lots of this stuff, but then you're putting it into her like a a teenage brain, really.
Simon Ursell [00:38:19]:
Yeah. Well, Caleb, yes. Absolutely. And and dangerous. I mean, it it doesn't sound like it's going all that well in terms of resilience and looking after them. However, what Caleb is doing is so exciting.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:38:32]:
Yeah. And they've had real success, actually. Like, lots of their teams kinda guess what again. Like, lots of their teams are winning stuff. Yeah. Exactly.
Simon Ursell [00:38:40]:
Yeah. If you don't beat up the kids and try and look after them and maybe feed them properly and stuff, they're gonna do a little better. Yeah. But he's right at the start. So here's a brand new thing. I mean, it's not a sport. As he pointed out, it's like all sport put together, loads of different games and but it just happens to be online. So it's right at the right at the cutting edge, right at the start.
Simon Ursell [00:39:01]:
I'm kind of I mean, I'm a huge fan, but I'm also jealous because it must be so great to be able to start in a world where you can effect such powerful change and help people so much.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:39:13]:
Yeah. I think you spoke about lots of low hanging fruit really, even just getting people to think of themselves like a team. Yeah. All the stuff we've spoken about, that wouldn't be the case. You'd compete individually, but now you're with a team and, well, actually, how are we gonna work together? How we're gonna get the best out of each other? How are we gonna help each other when
Simon Ursell [00:39:30]:
Looking at it well.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:39:31]:
Each of us distressed? Like, oh, what? Yeah. I pressed my compute buttons, Keller. Please stop trying to help me.
Simon Ursell [00:39:37]:
Yeah. Yeah. And you didn't know what Daley Thompson's decathlon was?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:39:40]:
No. So, yeah. So young.
Simon Ursell [00:39:42]:
I'm pretty sad about that because that's like part of my childhood. Yeah. Breaking buttons on a zed x spectrum. That's sad, isn't it? What a sad old man I am.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:39:50]:
Very sad. So yeah. No. It was just, again, fascinating. A world that I've spent a day in and observed it and all the stuff he spoke about. I've noticed, like, people not thinking of themselves as a team, people not physically looking after themselves. Real, like, identity. Again, we've chatted about that a lot, but the real identity of, I'm a computer gamer as opposed to like and again, lots of these young people haven't experienced anything else in their lives.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:17]:
Well, they're
Simon Ursell [00:40:17]:
burned out at 23.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:18]:
Yeah. I know.
Simon Ursell [00:40:19]:
24, you're too old.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:20]:
I know. They need Rich Brian to pick them up, don't they?
Simon Ursell [00:40:23]:
They do. They need a Rich Pine.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:25]:
And again, they will. That would be
Simon Ursell [00:40:26]:
Caleb, actually.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:27]:
They will. I'm sure they'll that'll be something that gets added to gaming, isn't it? They'll get their own kind of version of the RPA.
Simon Ursell [00:40:34]:
Yeah. And and maybe they'll maybe they'll chill out a little. Yeah. I don't know. I don't think they will, but maybe they will. Let's hope so. That was pretty cool.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:43]:
And, Karim, last but by no means least, you were pretty excited about that pod.
Simon Ursell [00:40:48]:
Yeah. Sorry. I can't believe you've forgotten possibly one of the most profound Coleman. Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:40:56]:
I was really forgettable, though, wasn't it? Like
Simon Ursell [00:40:58]:
Oh, really forgettable. Yeah. I mean, honestly, no idea what happened there. I mean, oh my god. That, yeah. I I still am quite upset. Yeah. Not not not in a really sad way, but just I just
Rusty Earnshaw [00:41:11]:
I didn't tell you what was gonna happen to the Europa League. That's not sure.
Simon Ursell [00:41:14]:
You didn't. Blimey. I mean, tell him I'm recording me going through an emotional roller coaster, but then I guess I'm I'm I'm in the same boat as the listeners listening to. And we've had I mean, I've had and you've had quite a few
Rusty Earnshaw [00:41:24]:
messages. Messages. And loads of people, like, have cried during it. I found it really, like, inspiring, like
Simon Ursell [00:41:31]:
I mean, yeah. There's a I mean, if you want somebody to come and talk to your team about resilience, just storytelling about resilience, we've gotta get him and Claire Murph together. Have they met?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:41:44]:
No. But I I should be on 10%. I've already connected with a couple of gigs. So
Simon Ursell [00:41:49]:
Yeah. You should.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:41:49]:
10% of nothing. Yeah. No no no. Dave, yeah, just incredible story.
Simon Ursell [00:41:56]:
His story's astonishing. I mean, how? I just keep thinking how? How is he still walking around? Yeah. I mean, remarkable human and a great story. I mean, in terms of in terms of hearing a resilient story and thinking about bounce back ability, he's he's got it all.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:42:16]:
Yeah. And the bit that really resonated for me was just when he said like, well, we'd all been through the best training. So, you know, we've all been in teams, business, sport, where you can look around the room and you go, we've been through a lot together, like, this is a pretty tight unit. So Yeah. And knowing that you are the best trained team out there is is a pretty helpful place to be.
Simon Ursell [00:42:40]:
Yeah. Definitely. I mean, he just had absolute total and utter trust. And I guess that maybe again, you know, given his story and how resilient he had to be, I think he did fall back on that. The fact that he had been through that shared experience, that amazing training with those guys and was able to be resilient because of it. So that sense that community and that, exceptional care that the Royal Marines gave him during training, has to have had a significant impact on his ability to withstand what he did. And we're not gonna tell you, listeners, what he what the story is because we won't do it justice. No.
Simon Ursell [00:43:15]:
You gotta listen to it. It's astonishing. Yeah. Astonishing story.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:43:21]:
And then Karim.
Simon Ursell [00:43:22]:
And then Karim.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:43:23]:
Yeah. Send it home. Send it home.
Simon Ursell [00:43:25]:
Well, yeah. I mean, when Karim I mean, that that podcast, I guess, sort of summed up a lot of stuff for me. I mean, I I'm kind of biased because, you know, I am on a bit of a mindfulness journey myself. But I do I do think it sort of maybe tied a few themes together. You know, I love the idea of, it was no dirt, no lotus.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:43:47]:
You love that idea.
Simon Ursell [00:43:48]:
I'd I've been I've been using that phrase all over the shop. I'm I'm You've
Rusty Earnshaw [00:43:50]:
been walking around the office carrying lotus.
Simon Ursell [00:43:53]:
I'm gonna be, a bit corny. I mean, but it's, possibly overused by Simon a little bit. But it but it does. I think it's so important. And it's that idea of walking towards challenge to become resilient. And I think so much of the world now protects us from challenge. You know, everything's done for you. Technology, all the stuff that we've been working on together as a society has meant that we're very insulated from challenge.
Simon Ursell [00:44:20]:
We don't although we are exposed to extreme challenges through social media and things which we're not really prepared for, but, we're really quite insulated so that when you come across extreme events, you quite often are just not prepared for it. So that idea of exposing ourselves to challenge and they're actually thinking this is a challenge, okay, rather than saying, oh, I won't do it then. Okay. Brilliant. That's exciting. Let's give it a go. That's, that's a really key message that I think came through Cream's pod.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:44:53]:
Yeah. I agree. And you've been so inspired by that that you are going for a week of
Simon Ursell [00:44:58]:
I'm gonna go play golf and
Rusty Earnshaw [00:44:59]:
play golf. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:45:02]:
I'm not
Rusty Earnshaw [00:45:02]:
Did that have challenges in playing golf?
Simon Ursell [00:45:03]:
No. I don't think so. I did but it was but I'm going for a whole week where I'm gonna be doing a lot of, what?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:45:08]:
This is the this is I mean, again, obviously, Luke's had a profound impact on you and, you speak a lot about Mia as well and this
Simon Ursell [00:45:16]:
Mia Mia has had the most profound impact on me. She's my mindfulness coach. Yeah. Mia Mia Chambers. Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:45:21]:
She's a wonderful person. She's a wonderful person. Become a Buddhist.
Simon Ursell [00:45:24]:
Priest. Yeah. I mean, she's been ordained, in in the summer, I think. Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. I mean
Rusty Earnshaw [00:45:30]:
Well, listeners, keep an eye for 2025 where Simon will be doing the same No. I wait. In Saint Andrews
Simon Ursell [00:45:36]:
There we go.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:45:37]:
With a golf club on either shoulder.
Simon Ursell [00:45:38]:
I will tell you all about my my, my trip to St. Andrews and, yeah, a week of golf and mindfulness, which, yeah, I I mean, it sounds like a lot of fun, frankly. Yeah. Not sure I'm walking towards Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:45:49]:
I love the way, you persuaded Jenny to let you go play golf for a week by claiming it was a mindfulness and golf retreat.
Simon Ursell [00:45:55]:
Yes. Absolutely. Well well, you know, or maybe she's thinking a week away from Simon Yippee. I don't know. Who knows? Who knows? Maybe she's getting out of that challenging zone by having me out of the house for a week. I don't know. I don't know. Maybe
Rusty Earnshaw [00:46:08]:
And what are you and what are you thinking towards 2025? What's, as well as the mindfulness stuff, what's
Simon Ursell [00:46:14]:
Well, yeah. I mean, what for me, personally Yeah. Yeah. A pod of I'm just curious. We've got some guests, don't we, that that we're thinking about. We're gonna do a TG pod, aren't we, when we talk about TG pod? Yeah. We're gonna do a I don't know how we're gonna do it. Thinking maybe a sort of live panel or something where we get a load of people and talk about what TG's been through because you and I speak well, I mean, we both I mean, obviously, I work a lot with TGB EDT.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:46:37]:
Yeah. Yeah. We call,
Simon Ursell [00:46:38]:
It's quite a cool it's quite a cool place, so that'd be quite an interesting one. We thought we might do an NHS one. We're gonna get a doctor or maybe a couple of doctors on something like that. I had a thought in the car coming over here that we could do, like, a young adult's one. What do you think of that?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:46:54]:
Freddie and Charles next door can, he's been swearing at his dad today. He can't go with him.
Simon Ursell [00:46:59]:
So Probably with justification today. But, yeah, we could get we could get our kids on. We could maybe get a few people we know. That'd be quite interesting, wouldn't it? Yeah. I mean, they will definitely take the mickey out of us. I mean, it'll be funny if nothing else. But I reckon now she
Rusty Earnshaw [00:47:15]:
has I might need some time to persuade. It might be a December pod.
Simon Ursell [00:47:19]:
Well, I don't know. Well, what do you think? Because that would be kinda cool, innit? Because they're probably gonna be able to talk about resilience in terms of things like social media Yeah.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:47:26]:
No. The
Simon Ursell [00:47:26]:
way better than us.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:47:27]:
Yeah. No. Definitely. Us subtle kits.
Simon Ursell [00:47:29]:
I mean, we we don't know what we're doing with them.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:47:31]:
I'll I'll put a proposal to him after this
Simon Ursell [00:47:33]:
one. He'll call you.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:47:33]:
To see how he lands. Yeah. He tells me that, oop, off.
Simon Ursell [00:47:36]:
Well I'll be there. Yeah. Not so sure I'll be able to persuade my own either. But anyway, yeah, listen out for that one. In terms of personal stuff, yeah, I'm just gonna carry on. I mean, I'm I'm doing a little bit less with Tyler Grooms. I'm still involved a heck of a lot, finding some other things, working with lots of other wonderful people. So, yeah, more of that.
Simon Ursell [00:47:53]:
What about you?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:47:55]:
Yeah. Well, actually, again, if anyone has any ideas or people they want to, I think, like, it would be great for people to reach out. I would definitely
Simon Ursell [00:48:01]:
For sure.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:48:02]:
Keen to hear what the listeners wanna hear from me. December, pretty buzzing for 2 weeks off, and then I've got yeah. I've got some fun every year's like playful, isn't it? Got some fun stuff off to NZ on the 3rd of Jan.
Simon Ursell [00:48:16]:
Oh, nice.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:48:17]:
Had a really, bounce back ability moment recently in New Zealand. I was my my world is often, like, I guess, close to the edge and with a coach, over there that I'm working with. And definitely, my intent wasn't the impact that I had and I was there's a moment where I thought I might be getting a flight home. Oh really? But it turned out to be okay. It's interesting as with a guy who I'm gonna get on on on my pod, there's a guy called Christian Penney, he's a coach developer and he he had some really beautiful language. He spoke about the coaches and he said our soft eyes, and by soft eyes he meant they're really approachable by the, Pacific Islander kids who wouldn't want someone to be staring at them and and front on with them and I love that phrase. But anyway, so I had this interaction that felt really heated and quite stressed and I could feel my heart rate and, I went over to Christian, he went well, that was the best bit of coach development you've done this week, wasn't it? And I was like, I hope so, Christian. I hope so.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:49:16]:
So those I definitely had a couple of karaoke moments in New Zealand, a few weeks ago and I'm excited for some in January as well.
Simon Ursell [00:49:24]:
That's exciting. Really exciting. Well, it's gonna be a I think 2025 is gonna be another amazing year for the pod. So
Rusty Earnshaw [00:49:31]:
Hopefully half the days of 2024.
Simon Ursell [00:49:33]:
Yeah. Let's hope so. But, yeah, I don't know. I wouldn't I wouldn't count on it. It seems to go so quick, buddy. Anyway, loved having you listening in. Please carry on. We're enjoying all the stuff you're sending us, so please stay in touch and get in touch with us and, yeah, bring on 2025.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:49:50]:
Over and out. Thanks so much for joining us on the Advanced Packability podcast with Simon Russell. We've really enjoyed your company. If you wanna reach out to us, Simon, where can they reach you?
Simon Ursell [00:50:01]:
LinkedIn's best place. Simon Ursel, u r s for sugar, e, double l. Send me a message. Rusty, where can we find you?
Rusty Earnshaw [00:50:07]:
TikTok? No. Not really. LinkedIn, Russ Lansaw. And then the same on Twitter, but please, ignore all my political thoughts. Yeah.
Simon Ursell [00:50:15]:
Second that.
Rusty Earnshaw [00:50:16]:
Over and out.
