The One With the Wives: Hobbies, headspace and happiness | Episode 37

A bit of a different one today! Rusty and Simon are joined by their wives, Jenny and Amy, for a post-lunch chat packed with funny and honest takes on hobbies (or lack thereof), mindfulness, and the real challenge of making time to properly switch off. From pottery and painting to sound baths, yoga, and  the simple act of staring out the window, they explore how creative outlets and shared moments can boost wellbeing – especially need while navigating parenting, screen time, and the pace of modern life. Full of laughs and relatable stories, this episode is a reminder that the small things we enjoy can make a big difference to balance, connection, and overall happiness.

In this episode:

·         The role of hobbies like pottery, painting, and chess in supporting mindfulness and wellbeing

·          Balancing personal interests with parenting and family life 

·         The impact of technology, screen time, and growing up in a digital world 

·         Humour, habits, and everyday quirks that shape how we unwind 

·         Rediscovering creativity and social connection as key drivers of resilience

Please like, subscribe or follow, so you're notified of any new episodes coming up, and if you're keen to reach Rusty or Simon with any suggestions, feedback or comments, you can contact them via the show's LinkedIn page here: 

https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-bouncebackability-podcast/

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Simon and Rusty here with the Bounce Back Ability Podcast. Podcast that explores how to deal with obstacles, setbacks and challenges. Hope you enjoy the pod. Looking forward to it. Listen on. Welcome to the pod, everybody. Live from my dining room where we've just had a massive lunch. So quite sleepy. Are you sleepy, Rusty?

SPEAKER_01 0:24

My wife's laughing uncontrollably.

SPEAKER_03 0:26

Yeah, yeah. So we've got we've got our wives here. Um we've just had uh yeah, very nice Sunday lunch. Thank you. Made by Jenny and uh nice bit of rain. And Jenny. And Jenny, yeah. I made the mint sauce. Oh, you did make the mint sauce, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 0:42

And a beautiful cheesecake to finish. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 0:45

It was all good. And then and that was about 40 minutes ago, and you've been sorting out the microphones and wires.

SPEAKER_03 0:51

He's just bullying, he's bullying me again. I'm being triggered, I'm being triggered.

SPEAKER_05 0:55

Rusty's head's about to blow.

SPEAKER_03 0:58

Yeah, so uh we thought it would be fun to do an episode with our wives because they have to put up with me and Rusty. And um, we thought a bit of resilience and bouncing back, being uh being married to Simon, being married to Rusty, probably quite qualified for having to bounce back from things. So yeah, we thought it'd be quite good fun to get them on.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

And both qualified in putting ceramics as well.

SPEAKER_03 1:25

So this is something we discovered.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

My wife's got a ceramics GCSE.

SPEAKER_03 1:29

And he didn't know, and you didn't know that. I didn't know that. And and and my wife has which I knew, so yeah, getting husband brownie points in.

SPEAKER_04 1:37

Luckily, I'm not a secret potter.

SPEAKER_03 1:38

No, no, you keep bringing pots back to that. But a ceramics GCSE does sound pretty cool.

SPEAKER_05 1:44

Oh, no. Not if you're rubbish at it, it's not.

SPEAKER_03 1:47

What is it? What grade did you get?

SPEAKER_05 1:49

I got a C, I've made pants. That's not rubbish.

SPEAKER_02 1:52

I mean yourself.

SPEAKER_05 1:54

I think there's a pig at home somewhere else. I'll find it. A pig. A pig. A ceramic pig. A ceramic pig and a pot.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

Very cool.

SPEAKER_05 2:05

I think that might be about it.

SPEAKER_01 2:07

And the ceramic knife as well that was used to cut the cheesecake.

SPEAKER_03 2:10

It must be that very ceramic themed lunch.

SPEAKER_05 2:12

I think we worked out that's decoration, not actually a knife, didn't we?

SPEAKER_04 2:15

Yeah, it was rubbish. I'm gonna give it again again next time. Please don't. It's too beautiful not to use. Maybe not with cheesecake. Well, I I think I might maybe a sponge. Yeah, maybe. Maybe you have obviously haven't eaten my sponges.

SPEAKER_05 2:29

Well, they're harder than the cheesecake.

SPEAKER_04 2:31

You might need something a bit more hardcore. Yeah. I'm gonna work on that. Sorry.

SPEAKER_03 2:36

I'm just trying to I'm trying to get Jenny to talk into the microphone.

SPEAKER_04 2:39

Okay, I'll I'll concentrate.

SPEAKER_05 2:41

This is our first podcast.

SPEAKER_04 2:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 2:42

Is it your first one?

SPEAKER_04 2:44

Is it?

SPEAKER_05 2:44

Is this your first one? Yes, I think it is my first podcast. I think I've only sang into a microphone for karaoke. And I've got spoken into one.

SPEAKER_04 2:52

It feels like slightly karaoke-esque.

SPEAKER_03 2:54

And what I'm particularly enjoying is basically the saying we're not going to say anything, we don't know what to say, we're not going to speak. Yeah, they had some lunch, eh?

SPEAKER_05 3:02

I I specifically said keep the wine away from me. And you went, Do you want another one? And I was like, Yeah, go on then. Well, it's worked.

SPEAKER_04 3:11

So true. Also, I just I do find it quite difficult not to say anything for about two minutes. That's true.

SPEAKER_03 3:19

I can confirm.

SPEAKER_04 3:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 3:23

As much as I might say that, I'm not going to say anything.

SPEAKER_03 3:25

I so it's a noisy household because I'm not that great either.

SPEAKER_05 3:29

At being quiet? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:31

No. I don't know. Rusty's being quiet, which is which is suspicious.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

I'm just wondering like how it where this is gonna go. I know.

SPEAKER_03 3:39

I've I have no idea where it's gonna go.

SPEAKER_05 3:41

Expackability.

SPEAKER_03 3:42

Well, we started off with pot pottery, didn't we? So I I think I think that's quite a mindful thing. Doing stuff with your hands and not and disengaging the thinking bit of your brain. Is that the right way?

SPEAKER_05 3:56

That sounds really potters, Simon. I think you might have offended a whole group of people here.

SPEAKER_03 4:03

Yeah, well, I'm not intending to, but yeah, I probably have. I just realised how that sounded. But you use a different bit of your brain, don't you? And you're doing something practical. Is that right? I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

I have no idea. Well, unless I'm thinking about and now I'm having flashbacks to you talking about being a shepherd as well. Yeah, I was a shepherd.

SPEAKER_03 4:20

When I was when I was sort of in my late teens. My dad, who was a surgeon, had 60 ewes. It was his hobby to look after the sheep, which mainly involved saying, Simon, can you go and look after the sheep? So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

And maybe it's hobbies that are mindful, and actually, less people have hobbies now. Maybe wonder what our kids' hobbies are, but and your kids' hobbies.

SPEAKER_05 4:44

Well, they get taken up with screen time, don't they?

SPEAKER_01 4:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:47

Oh, yeah, mobile phones.

SPEAKER_05 4:49

Yeah, that's a hobby.

SPEAKER_03 4:50

The devil.

SPEAKER_05 4:51

The devil.

SPEAKER_03 4:52

The absolute devil. Yeah, well there are hobbies, I mean, isn't it? I mean, I we've been talking quite a bit. I mean, I've I've I don't have a lot of hobbies at the moment. I used to. I play a bit of golf.

SPEAKER_04 5:03

Well, I think the strange thing is that when you've got children, you tend to spend a lot of time.

SPEAKER_05 5:10

Like and you just take them to their hobbies, which then is your hobby, just to take them. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 5:15

Although, although I did, you know, I have really enjoyed that you meet lots of other people, don't you? And it's sociable and it's fun, and but you do you almost forget what you like to do if you've actually got time spare. And also you get used to everything. If you've got a couple of hours for you or something, you feel you should do something productive, I don't think. But you could, I mean, this isn't going to happen, but you know, you could just fall into thinking that you could just clean another bit of your house or yeah, you know, do some sort of job.

SPEAKER_05 5:44

Or watch something else on Netflix.

SPEAKER_04 5:46

Watch something else on Netflix.

SPEAKER_05 5:47

And then copies go out the window.

SPEAKER_04 5:49

Yes, exactly. Or you went to YouTube films.

SPEAKER_03 5:53

So you you you took your daughter swimming, you know.

SPEAKER_05 5:55

Well, Elsa swims like gosh, 12, 13 hours a week. So rather than just sitting on the balcony and watching, I do classes, gym classes, not pottery classes.

SPEAKER_03 6:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 6:07

And I like that. That's good for me. That's good for my mindfulness. Yeah, I would say so, yeah. Rather than sort of like sitting and being one, I like to exercise. I think that helps me a lot.

SPEAKER_03 6:20

Yeah, I mean, mindfulness doesn't mean sitting right on.

SPEAKER_05 6:23

No.

SPEAKER_03 6:24

It's not necessarily.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

I mean you can. Although a friend did say that he's not using he goes on the bus up to you needs it's about 25 minutes and he's now stopped uh using his phone on the bus. He just wants to sit there in silence 25 minutes.

SPEAKER_05 6:37

Yeah, I get that. Looking out the window, that is nice. People watching.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

Well, daydreaming is is a brilliant thing. 100%. Not a lot of that happens now because you're so on time.

SPEAKER_05 6:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:49

Yeah. So I think there's a lot to be said around hobbies for building up your resilience and your ability to deal with shit. I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 6:58

I think I've always been a daydreamer, actually. My my mum gave me some um reports from when I was at school and I read them and it just it took me back. And basically it says that I spend a lot of time daydreaming. Yeah. Um and that um I could uh that also I talk too much and that I lack concentration. And I thought you don't change a lot from the age of 13 to as you get older, you stay the same. I still recognise myself in my school reports weirdly.

SPEAKER_03 7:27

Oh, that's a good point. I mean, do you change? Have you have you changed much, Rusty?

SPEAKER_05 7:32

I was uh Oh, he's become a right softy. Has he? Yeah, I think he was a right soft.

SPEAKER_02 7:41

Well, this is get come on the same more. This is the whole point of getting all eyes on.

SPEAKER_05 7:47

Yeah, wouldn't you say?

SPEAKER_01 7:49

What do you what do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_05 7:51

Uh I mean you've always been very kind, but I just think that you are a lot, I don't know, fluffier? I don't know what the word would be.

SPEAKER_02 8:00

You're just uh fluffy, rusty.

SPEAKER_05 8:02

Fluffy, rusty. Maybe.

SPEAKER_04 8:05

Yeah, empathise more. Do you sort of like get a tear in your eye if someone does something that's really nice to say?

SPEAKER_05 8:12

Does he get a tear in his eye? Or fluffy. Well, Russ, Russ cries at fake things, not real things. Am I right or am I right?

SPEAKER_01 8:20

I cry both. I cry at both. No, you don't.

SPEAKER_05 8:22

You cry at like really terrible things on TV, like, I mean, can I name a show?

SPEAKER_06 8:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 8:28

Love is blind. Russ is obsessed, obsessed. He watched them in all different languages and he'll cry his eyes out. Really? Can't bear it.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

Really?

SPEAKER_05 8:36

It's not the crying, it's not the crying, it's love is blind.

SPEAKER_01 8:39

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Love things as well. But that's a real thing though, isn't it, Russ?

SPEAKER_04 8:44

Is that is that crying when people find love or did you take over?

SPEAKER_02 8:50

They were taking over from the start, we have no control.

SPEAKER_04 8:53

Yeah. Um I think you've definitely softened up as well. Your question. Yeah, I wonder if it's I wonder if it's like old age. Maybe.

SPEAKER_05 9:02

Older age. Older age, older age, older, older age, not old age, older age.

SPEAKER_02 9:07

Absolute outrage, Amy.

SPEAKER_05 9:10

So sorry.

SPEAKER_03 9:12

Yeah, no, I think as you get older, you tend to be a bit more well. Life experience teaches you something about things, doesn't it? I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 9:20

It's like when we choose things to watch on TV as well, we like things where it's just where it's really lovely and people are nice to each other.

SPEAKER_05 9:28

Do you I I like a psychological thriller?

SPEAKER_04 9:30

Is that not? Well, you know, there are because I also watch the next one. Happy Valley's very good, so we really enjoy that. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:40

Recommendations for shows will be in the notes.

SPEAKER_05 9:42

BBC, it's so good. This is our last podcast. Just rambling on. It's this what podcasting is, just rambling on.

SPEAKER_02 9:54

It it is for rest of the Simon, yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's good. This is basically our last podcast.

SPEAKER_04 9:59

And have you got a definition for mindfulness then? What is mindfulness?

SPEAKER_03 10:02

Oh god. Oh, yeah, we don't know, do we? We've gone over this quite a few times. We actually hate the word mindfulness. We do that.

SPEAKER_04 10:08

We use a different word then.

SPEAKER_03 10:09

Well, it's just you know, I mean because what does it could be dangerous, well, mindfulness is just really connotations of quite specific things like you say, you think sitting cross-legged in the coach's position going on, and that's not I mean, that is I mean, I guess that's a form of mindfulness, but I always spend a lot of time wondering how long that bit's gonna go on because my legs are aching.

SPEAKER_04 10:31

Oh, yeah, we've just started doing yoga, haven't we?

SPEAKER_05 10:35

And literally, it's so funny because whenever they start, I just can't keep my eyes shut. I'm looking, I have to look around and see what else everyone else is doing. Questions.

SPEAKER_02 10:47

I can't. So Rusty's there with his eyes shut and you're just looking around giggling.

SPEAKER_01 10:55

They did have a good quote at the last one, which was uh to be a free spirit takes discipline, which I loved. So all of the stuff you're talking about there, Jenny, about when you were younger and stuff. I do yeah, I think as you get older, it takes more discipline to do those things. It's a great space for yourself to to be playful, to yeah, to do whatever you want to call mindfulness.

SPEAKER_03 11:18

Yeah, but we don't like the word mindfulness.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

Okay, what do you want to change it to?

SPEAKER_03 11:22

Daydreaming. Daydreaming scripts, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

Um yeah, but I'm able to I'm able to like empty my brain anyway, so you know that and like go blank. Yeah, I can't do that. You can't do that.

SPEAKER_03 11:33

Nobody else can other than Rusty's empty.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

So you do you two are stressing about everything.

SPEAKER_04 11:38

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 11:39

I have everything going through my head.

SPEAKER_04 11:41

I know. Well, I I think I I I obviously I dre I dream a lot, and I I do actually sort the world out generally while I'm sleeping. And then when I wake up in the morning, I have this sort of list basically of things that I've sorted out and have solved.

SPEAKER_03 11:56

And um most of which involves Simon doing something. Most of which involves something.

SPEAKER_01 12:01

Yeah, same. I cheated on my wife uh last month three times, didn't I? In your dreams.

SPEAKER_03 12:05

In your dreams, yeah, yeah. So Jenny does this as well. And it's me, I mean, are you really angry with him for a while afterwards for that? You're not enjoying the podcast to watch the ladies.

SPEAKER_05 12:19

I know that I will I will kill him, and he knows that.

SPEAKER_04 12:24

I I I felt sort of I was I was shocked because I really felt that I knew Simon and I couldn't believe that he would do something like that.

SPEAKER_05 12:32

I wasn't even here, I wasn't.

SPEAKER_04 12:36

Honesty, yes, yeah. Shocking for the thing they did. I don't know if you say in your actual dream. Yeah, I admit I was quite grumpy when I first woke up as well afterwards because I just I was you've done it more than once. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:50

Don't make out that this was a one-off.

SPEAKER_04 12:52

No, it's true. It's true. Do you do you never dream? Do I ever do things like that?

SPEAKER_03 12:56

I I don't remember you cheating on me in a dream night.

SPEAKER_04 13:00

No.

SPEAKER_03 13:00

Most of my dreams involve playing rugby golf.

SPEAKER_04 13:05

Actually, that's not true.

SPEAKER_03 13:07

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_05 13:08

Running out for England. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:11

You know, sometimes when you when you see a dog sleeping and um it looks like they're chasing rabbits, and you think that's really sweet. Simon scores tries in his sleep sometimes. Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_03 13:20

Yeah, I I think I'm living my best life.

SPEAKER_04 13:22

And then he wakes up and then basically looks at me as if I've made a noise and waken him up. So like, what? What? Uh I'll just score a try. You've just scored a try, sweetie. It's okay. Okay, back to sleep.

SPEAKER_03 13:35

Yeah. So yes, mindfulness is is a um is a many many layered thing. Well, we went and did a sound bath, didn't we?

SPEAKER_01 13:44

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 13:45

We went we went to the story of this.

SPEAKER_01 13:47

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 13:47

Yeah. Yeah, we went to King Charles' house and did a soundbath. Because he's just down the road from here.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

Uh-huh. And you were the only man there.

SPEAKER_03 13:55

Yeah. There's a room of, I don't know, 20 or 30 people. I was the only plate. It was it was mad. I actually really enjoyed it at this time.

SPEAKER_04 14:04

Yeah, I loved it. I loved it.

SPEAKER_03 14:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:07

She played some lovely piano music and well, also, it's like a concert, but you're lying down on a really comfy sort of.

SPEAKER_05 14:14

Oh, but the aim is to what, like relax out to your head? What what do you can't? What's the aim of it? Are you when you walk out? What's the aim of it?

SPEAKER_03 14:22

I take no there's an actual aim. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 14:24

Something to enjoy the moment in the moment.

SPEAKER_03 14:26

I think so. And just well, it's very so I've done I've done a few now, and that when with Suzanne, who's doing on the podcast, when she's done one, it's been pretty intense. I mean, it would be with Suzanne doing it, let's be honest.

SPEAKER_01 14:39

Yes, I've not been to Suzanne's soundbaths.

SPEAKER_03 14:43

It was it was pretty bonkers. But she she Suzanne, she's got these different sized balls that are made out of some sort of crystal or something, so they're different for sound frequencies. And so she uses the balls to play noises.

SPEAKER_05 14:57

A bit like when you do on your crystal glass.

SPEAKER_03 14:59

Yeah, similar to that. Yeah, the sort of ringing.

SPEAKER_05 15:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:02

And it's light, I mean, it's like you're there for light. I mean, how long does it last? Because you went for a walk on the last one I did. So how long were you? Yeah, it's quite a while. It's like an hour and a half. All my days. Yeah, but I mean, to be honest, I I mean I fell asleep, obviously.

SPEAKER_04 15:15

Um I think it's really relaxing, you know, because I think if you've got quite a busy mind and you're thinking about lots of things and I just get really restless.

SPEAKER_05 15:22

So when we do an hour and a half hour and a half of yoga, oh I can't deal. I have to we have to leave, don't we? Do you actually have like a sweet spot though? I have about 45 minutes in me, and then I'm like, I this is this is I need to get going now. Yeah, get a bit fidgety.

SPEAKER_04 15:41

No, I can do that as well, or I can get start to get really uncomfortable. I think well, actually, I've had massages before where I've just really wanted them to finish because actually really uncomfortable, but I don't like to say anything separate.

SPEAKER_05 15:51

It's embarrassing, gonna upset them. They'd be you realize they can't possibly tell you.

SPEAKER_04 16:00

Yeah, yeah, because then you can't really admit it's not very relaxing. Brilliant, but um I think the sound is it's really quite amazing. It's it it um you can feel the vibrations, and the lady who did it was actually playing a piano and that was in the centre of the room, and then it was sort of a wood sprung floor, so you can feel the vibrations coming in through the pink Charles's pine and the music was beautiful, Poshawitch, she was very good, um, and we were all cozy and warm, and you had all the bird song, and um yeah, I did I did actually feel really relaxed, and I had I I think I did actually manage not to think about anything for quite a long period of time until I sort of sort of started rustling around. Like you, I do have that sort of time period where I can do nothing for yeah, yeah. Then I've sort of world out again.

SPEAKER_05 16:50

Then something creeps in and then that's it.

SPEAKER_04 16:52

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:54

But it's quite cool. I mean, so I think King Charles is quite into that sway, that's why it was laid out. So there were I think she's she was doing these things as part of he's he's trying to sort of promote that sort of alternative way of thinking. But I I suspect, because it must be very stressful being King Charles, I think. I mean, it can't be easy, let's be honest. No, and I imagine he needs stuff like that to help him get through the day. I don't know. So it's you you've got to have some sort of way of I think whatever works for you, right? And if that was the Yeah, but it talks to plants, doesn't he? He's famously talks to the people.

SPEAKER_05 17:32

That's true, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:33

Yeah. Because we did a tour of his garden as well, didn't we? Which is quite which is totally it's when they talk back your memory, right? Yes, the plants talk back. Yeah, you probably gotta stop taking those pills. Maybe change your medication. But uh but it's a um it I guess yeah, the the sort of hobby side of things, most of that is mindfulness, isn't it? I think. I guess that's where this is going. You know, the daydreaming, you know, Fred sitting on the bus, putting his phone away and just watching the world go by, that's pretty cool. I mean, that is that is pure mindfulness for me. And it's interesting what you're saying about your school report and it basically being the same knack, it says I can't I don't know who said it, but it's a Buddhist philosophy, wherever you go, there you are. It's uh you you can't you can't remove yourself, you are who you are, and wherever you're going and being a bit comfortable with that helps you deal with stuff. So I I think these kinds of hobbies, whatever works for you, you know, if it's a sound bath, if it's pottery, if it's spin classes, if it's sitting on a bus, if it's only rusty, you you do a million and one things, don't you?

SPEAKER_01 18:47

You always light off sauna, cold, cold swimming. Cold swimming. You'd have your cold swimming. Listening to music, walking, being in nature, skiing. I'm pretty good at finding ways of switching off. Well, it's uh I switched on a lot.

SPEAKER_03 19:05

It's um it's really interesting. I was talking to uh a friend of Caleb Cousins, he's been on the pot, Ryan Fitzpatrick, from Adamus Sports. So for one of the ums, this is uh esports, so kids playing computer games, which is the biggest sport in the world, apparently. Yeah, which we didn't know, did we at all? Caleb told us about it. More people watch that they'll watch all other sports combined.

SPEAKER_05 19:31

Bonkers.

SPEAKER_03 19:32

Absolutely bonkers, which I just don't understand. But I'm just fascinated by his world. But he was he was talking about some of these things about creating we were talking about creativity and having a way of switching your brain off from being active so that you can imagine and think and daydream and drift around is is how you come up with your best ideas. That's when all the magic happens. That's the most powerful bit of your brain. So if you're not switching off and knowing that work sometimes, it's it's not that great. And that's what with with gamers, they're basically just wake up, eat a KFC game, have another KFC game, have another KFC game, go to sleep, and then you do that seven days a week.

SPEAKER_01 20:13

I mean yeah, I just started working with a guy through Caleb James, and he's uh coach of coaches in esports and yeah, even just getting them to lead in inverted commerce normal lives.

SPEAKER_03 20:26

Yeah, we yeah, Ryan was talking about maximal gain, so it's so it's just no point going on.

SPEAKER_05 20:32

But these people are like addicted to playing online. Like, is there is like sorry, I don't hop don't help anyone upset anyone, but is this like a like to do that, that's got to be like a slight addiction, which is like it's if this is the biggest sport in the like the world, is this a bit like I think it's a job.

SPEAKER_03 20:50

It's a job for a lot of people, yeah. So they they're just really really good at it. Yeah, they've got the most unbelievable reflexes, and you I mean 21, you're too old. Your reflexes start going, and yeah, 23 you're done.

SPEAKER_05 21:04

Really? Wow, and then what you do?

SPEAKER_03 21:05

Well then yeah, then you go into the real world. Do you go and get a job? Well, hopefully you've made millions and millions of pounds and you have to do it.

SPEAKER_05 21:11

And they just gain for love the love of it.

SPEAKER_03 21:13

Just just cruise around. Wow. I mean, yeah, it's pretty brutal, basically. They they're um the turn I I think they are working on trying to help them last a bit longer. But yeah, it was uh it was another fact. I just I'm slightly obsessed with the world of gaming.

SPEAKER_04 21:31

I don't know enough about it, but I think it's sort of opposite of things I enjoy. I think it's I don't know, it's just really lovely going out and meeting people and seeing things and this is what Rusty is touching on, I think.

SPEAKER_03 21:43

It's like you know, these kids aren't living normal lives. They're just in this weird, thirty unhealthy world, and it's it's not great for them. So they're trying to encourage them to to not just play games.

SPEAKER_05 21:57

Because it's all quite new, like are there like loads of regulations around It's key like safeguard. Like I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 22:02

I I have no idea. I'd imagine there are regulations, but I think it's a good idea.

SPEAKER_05 22:06

If it's quite new, they probably need they're probably in there. That's brilliant. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:09

Well, I think I mean yeah, I think some countries, I think China limited like internet time for people, and obviously some countries are starting to think about the use of mobile phones and Australia have banned under 60. Yeah. Are they gonna ban that in the UK?

SPEAKER_05 22:23

Yeah, I think it's coming in.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

Well, gosh, I don't know actually. Is it coming in? Elsa's Elsa just said there's no way they'll make that work. Really?

SPEAKER_05 22:31

Yeah, but I don't think they're making it work. I don't think it's working that i in Australia. Like kids can get around it easily, can't they? Like, you know, there's um apps that you have to be like 13 of and you get like nine-year-olds on it. They just they get kids will get around it. It's just they're not allowed to.

SPEAKER_04 22:49

Yeah, and actually they're much better at using them than we are. So they're the right away. Yeah, yeah. I know I used to joke that I was going to check the boys' internet history, but I didn't actually really know how to do that.

SPEAKER_05 22:59

Oh, or do you know what you used to turn the internet off? Do you remember at night? We used to turn it off and stop Fred using it. No, just hear him creeping up the stairs to try and turn it back on again. Do you remember we did that?

SPEAKER_01 23:13

Yeah, he just asked me. Uh we were just at Samba this last week, and the kids were were were class, although some of them were a little bit annoying at times, and he was like, Duh. So I'm really annoying when I was little.

SPEAKER_05 23:25

Not when you're little. We're joking, Freddie, we're joking.

SPEAKER_02 23:31

Teenagers.

SPEAKER_05 23:32

I know. Do you remember when the boys used to pretend they were a dog?

SPEAKER_04 23:36

That was that used to be a dog. Oh, that's the most advice. Yeah, granddad didn't like it, it drove him nuts. That drove me nuts.

SPEAKER_03 23:44

I I solved it because so are your dog, you have to go outside.

SPEAKER_05 23:48

Eat from the bowl. They didn't mind eating from the bowl.

SPEAKER_03 23:50

They wish they would have happily eaten from the bowl. That wouldn't have worked. But if they had to go outside in the cold and I shut the door and said you can't come back in until you're not a dog. They would just woof back at you then because obviously they're rather than speaking, they would just bark. Yeah, it was properly irritating.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

Yeah, we just did uh it was Sebra in Italy, and I was just thinking about like the experience of the kids. No one's really on their phone that much. Loads of the parents like our kids okay, like they haven't been in touch with us, we can't get hold of them. Fantastic. And they just are in nature playing rugby. We're in Italy as well, and again, all the stuff that you know, look with the rugby club, all the stuff that rugby should be, community and sit round and eat constantly, quite frankly. Um, but like everyone sat down, all the kids, all the girls had their pastoral lunch, and it was just quite like that way of living.

SPEAKER_05 24:45

But Elsa went to Morocco last year for how long was she there for? Like eight, nine days. Yeah. And they weren't allowed to take their phones. So obviously, first of all, there was mass panic, all these teenagers having to go away for over a week, and they were told absolutely no phones, they will get confiscated if they take their phones with them. And then she came back and she was like, I don't even want it. She was so like just so much better without it.

SPEAKER_03 25:09

That's the sad thing though, isn't it? Because you I mean, you kind of then you're back in that world where you everybody does live in that online world, so you're back you're drawn back into it whether you want it or not.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:18

Which is what the ban is so great, because it takes that peer pressure, that community doesn't exist, so you can meet in real life.

SPEAKER_04 25:28

But you but you know that you know, you know that you're better off not being on your phone all the time. Sometimes I'll go, I'll I'll be doing something and and I'll be really um sort of focused on it, and then all of a sudden I'll think I haven't checked my phone for about four hours. Um, and I and I'll and I'll immediately go and hunk my phone and see if I've missed anything. Which uh which happens not normally, yeah, or nothing interesting anyway.

SPEAKER_03 25:53

But um you might have missed some TikToks of dogs.

SPEAKER_05 25:55

Yeah, but you get you get this TikToks of dogs. Or kids being dogs.

SPEAKER_04 26:01

Oh kids being dogs. Oh, that is the last thing I've watched. TikTok of dogs being relaxing. But you do get that feeling, it's like, oh, you know, oh haven't been on my phone. I don't know. That everything could have, you know, loads of things could have happened and I won't know about them. Or someone could have been trying to get hold of you.

SPEAKER_05 26:18

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

We were uh we went to see James in concert the other day, and um and we're gonna see uh we're going again this weekend with JB, although my wife's probably not that excited about driving three hours to Manchester. But um there weren't that many people on take on phones, was there? Like if you think you look at concerts now, there'll be lots of people on their phones. There's the guy in front of us who's the biggest James fan ever.

SPEAKER_05 26:44

Yeah, knew all the words to every single song. I knew I knew I literally I know four Jane songs, and they played how many? Maybe one of them.

SPEAKER_01 26:52

Yeah, they didn't place it down. That's it.

SPEAKER_05 26:55

Because we're all of a certain age or we can't sit down on the floor and get back again.

SPEAKER_01 27:01

And then the other thing that Fred said the other day, all the kids were talking about using Claude or whatever it is. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. So like I'm talking about like nine and ten-year-old kids like my calls.

SPEAKER_05 27:12

I asked Fred for help for certain things. He's like, or just chat GT, whatever it. And I'm like, can you just help me? Like, I don't want to do that, I just want a real personality.

SPEAKER_01 27:20

Fred said to me the other day, I have no idea how you did university without AI. No, really, and and then another kid went, or the internet, because obviously like we didn't really have computers when I was at uni, and so uh you'd have to do pen and paper.

SPEAKER_04 27:36

I was I was I was talking to um Dan and Ollie about it, and um, you know, you'd beset some essay or something, and there'd there was only one book in the library, and um it would have been booked out by everyone else, so you'd have to but then you just eventually get to look at it for 10 minutes, you know, before you did finish your essay. And uh there was sort of quite incredible, I really didn't believe that. It's like, yeah, no, honestly, and we you wouldn't buy your own book because it would be about£50 or something, some huge amount of money for some gigantic volume or something. But there was no other way of finding it out other than reading, was there?

SPEAKER_03 28:15

Um, no, it's uh it's a it's a very different world that they're growing up in now to us. But to draw it back to the start of the conversation and talking about hobbies, I think with us empty nesting as we are have been. Kids have moved out, and our lives are very much work, kids sort of trying to find stuff that we well, we are both discovering things we used to do when we were younger, aren't we? He was lottery, me, I was still looking. Golf. A bit of golf, yeah. I'm playing a lot more golf. But I I don't know. I mean I'm I'm I'm more interested in trying to find something I can do that's a bit more practical. I mean golf is a hobby, I guess, but I'm I'm looking for something that's a bit more less a bit more sort of creative, I think is the right word. I don't know what it's gonna be yet, but I do want to do something. Um I enjoy painting. I did some s did some uh art with Luke Doherty from MPP. Did some of it because he's a really good artist. Have you seen the stuff he's done? It's very good, absolutely incredible. So yeah, hobbies are important to us. What about you guys? I mean, did you I mean, you know, you've got your exercise and obviously you have to get creativity, sort of things like that.

SPEAKER_05 29:37

Um paints, she's pretty remarkable, I don't know. Oh yeah, her painting's ridiculous, so good. So annoying. I don't know how she where she gets it from.

SPEAKER_03 29:47

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 29:48

I'm terrible.

SPEAKER_03 29:49

Well, maybe you could discover a secret talent for it if you tried.

SPEAKER_05 29:53

Maybe. I'm good at copying, so maybe you never know. Um god, hobbies for us.

SPEAKER_03 30:01

I can't think of anything that I wouldn't got any, so I mean I it's only Jenny's the one that's I have tried to learn chess, it just doesn't stay in my head.

SPEAKER_05 30:11

Uh yeah, I'd quite like to learn how to do that, play that.

SPEAKER_03 30:15

Yeah. I I I mean we're you're you're really quite good at chess.

SPEAKER_04 30:19

Oh yeah. I used to play chess a lot when I was younger. I think that's part of it. I think it's just playing and playing and playing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:25

Dan went a chess club at primary school. So different. And Jenny did it with them as well.

SPEAKER_05 30:31

Did he go to like the mega finals and all that crazy stuff?

SPEAKER_03 30:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 30:34

Yeah, he went to proper nerdy. Yeah, like chess like a bit aggressive though. Yeah, and then all these like you know, these kids will come out of their session and you see all the dads giving them tips. And I'm like, protein tips, dude. I have no idea what's going on. John of outside. Yeah, no idea what's happening here. Even protein shakes, bananas, and breaks. Yeah, absolutely bonkers.

SPEAKER_03 30:55

Yeah. But isn't that? I mean, it's I mean, yeah, I guess chess is chess, chess uh apparently is quite an aggressive game. I but I mean it doesn't look it, does it?

SPEAKER_05 31:04

No.

SPEAKER_03 31:06

That's a that is a cool thing. But it's quite a sort of it's a very reflective, contemplative game if you don't treat it like a war.

SPEAKER_05 31:14

Yeah, and rage quit. Rage quit, just chuck it, yeah, chuck everything across the room.

SPEAKER_04 31:20

It's nice to have a bit of a challenge though, isn't it? And feel you know that you're achieving something and you're getting better at something, or but I think sometimes, you know, I I was quite tempted to learn the piano again. I've always wanted to play the piano. Um, my grandmother, um she was very musical. My my grandfather was a sort of professional violinist, so there should be some musical bones in me. But even though I had so many piano lessons, I'm truly dreadful at playing the piano. Um so then when I was thinking You can play Ollie the Octopus. I can. I can play about three songs anyway. Well, then I was thinking about it. I was thinking about actually I don't know if I should put myself through that really. It's just Yeah. I I don't really have a huge amount of rhythm, and I just in it. No, I've decided that I I want to do something that I actually just really, really want to be able to really want to enjoy. I don't mind a bit of challenge, but I'm also going to accept when when actually something's really just very hard. Not for you, not for me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 32:20

It's not your favourite hobby. No, it's terrifying.

SPEAKER_03 32:23

Do you ski? Too fast, no, no.

SPEAKER_05 32:25

Oh, it's terrifying. Have you ever skied?

SPEAKER_03 32:27

Yeah, yeah. Terrifying. I don't know, I don't find it terrifying.

SPEAKER_04 32:31

Jenny, do you ski? Um, I've skied a couple of times. Um, I do find it quite scary because I do worry about it.

SPEAKER_01 32:36

Shout out to Twiggy who snapped all the ligaments in his right knee, left knee.

SPEAKER_04 32:41

Yeah. Oh, wow. Yeah, I don't think I fall over as well as I used to.

SPEAKER_05 32:45

You can't get back up. No, it's can't. Can it's like it's it's like torture for me. I just can't do it.

SPEAKER_03 32:52

So we've eliminated skiing. Um, hasn't it?

SPEAKER_05 32:55

Prey skiing.

SPEAKER_04 32:56

At prey ski. At prey ski sounds great fun. I think I could excel at it. Can't call that a hobby though, can we? That's just drinking and eating.

SPEAKER_03 33:02

Well, some people do. It's kind of, yeah, for me.

SPEAKER_05 33:09

Not healthy.

SPEAKER_03 33:11

Brilliant would.

SPEAKER_05 33:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:12

Um, so yeah, well, um, thanks for coming on, ladies.

SPEAKER_05 33:16

Are we off now?

SPEAKER_03 33:17

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are we done?

SPEAKER_05 33:18

Come on, Jenny, we're gonna go in the game.

SPEAKER_03 33:23

We have done 33 minutes so far. Okay. So, yeah, I think um yeah, we've we've explored many topics. None of which have been that embarrassing, thank goodness.

SPEAKER_04 33:38

No, you've got off lately.

SPEAKER_03 33:41

But yeah, thanks for coming on and uh and thanks for lunch, Jenny. Thanks for coming over.

SPEAKER_04 33:45

Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

Bye.

SPEAKER_03 33:46

Bye bye.

SPEAKER_01 33:48

Who'd have known that our wives would be better at podcasts than we are?

SPEAKER_03 33:52

I I would have I would have predicted that. Well, I got some feedback off Jenny as as she went because they've just gone off to make some tea, and she said, Yeah, you need to plan that a bit better. I think you could have planned your questions better. So yeah, good feedback for Simon.

SPEAKER_01 34:09

Dig in, dig in.

SPEAKER_03 34:11

My wife was quite good, actually. Well, I thought they were both pretty good actually. I genuinely think they would do a better job than us. You know, which is embarrassing.

SPEAKER_00 34:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:20

Um, but predictable.

SPEAKER_00 34:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:23

But it's quite interesting um just talking about that's raising families, isn't it, is quite tough. And realising that kids are just so badly affected by phones.

SPEAKER_01 34:34

Yeah, I know, I don't know. Honestly, we just spent a week with kids, you know, the amount of ADHD, you know, people on meds, all that type of stuff.

SPEAKER_03 34:44

Like, just turn the phone off.

SPEAKER_01 34:46

Yeah, but just like honestly, just different kids out of their phones. And again, just to see the panic in the parents' eyes that you know, had they hadn't been in touch and they've just been super engaged, going for river swims. Even though I had to tell them that they weren't allowed to go for river swims. So if anyone asked them, they'd say, What river? Um, but yeah, just being in nature, running around, being kids, meeting new people, the one of the everyone does a postcard, and we've usually done like the coaches' view of it, and this time it's it's half like what I loved coach about coaching you, and then there's a bit about what I loved from the kids.

SPEAKER_03 35:22

Yeah. Oh my god. Go on. Just give us some examples.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

Meeting your friends, yeah, swimming in the river, hanging out with new people. Stuff that we would have taken for granted in our food, go to the green door, all the experiences basically, not like and of course some rugby stuff. The 5022 game, getting coached a kick by Jolly Hodgson, like yeah, just some real like cool stuff that wasn't phones or well, they didn't have access to computers either, so or computer games, so we watched a little bit of like rugby stuff together and yeah, it was class.

SPEAKER_03 36:02

Wow. Yeah, it's I mean it's it is interesting, isn't it? Because that would have been our childhoods. I mean, I spent all of my time outside. There were no phones, there were no computers, there was no internet. Yeah. And I mean Jenny and I were talking about this the other day, actually were just saying we just we just were thrown out. It's like get out of the house. Yeah. And you just had to make your own and you were bored a lot of the time. That I guess that is it's the lack of boredom, I think, is what's really shocking for me. You've got to be bored. That's when you're being that's when the bit of your brain that isn't conscious is working its hardest. Um, and then you and you have to create your own games and things. And even our kids though, when they were very so my two, there was no, there weren't mobile phones until sort of when when would that have happened? Probably early secondary school, it would have started coming in quite strongly. I mean they they had texting and that kind of stuff, but it wasn't really like ubiquitous social media, so they spent a lot of time reading books and doing puzzles and playing with toys, jigsaws, yeah, jigsaws, all that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_01 37:10

Like none of us mentioned jigsaws in our hobbies, although I do love a jigsaw.

SPEAKER_03 37:14

Oh, yeah, we do. I mean, we have a jigsaw every year, we do as a family at Christmas.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

I took uh I went to see my mum on Friday up north, and uh I'd I'd said we were driving back to December, and uh I was like, Oh, we'll go past my old school, Fred. And uh so went past my old school, and I remember walking there and back every day and past where I used to be, used to go to the Cubs and for Scouts, and Fred just went, Dad, do you ever get nostalgic? And I was like, Yeah, definitely now, like, yeah, it's like Yeah, of course, nostalgic. It's just different, isn't it? I do love the uh and again Instagram, but uh the the ones where they go, Hey kids, we're gonna take you back to the 80s, and everyone's like on their bikes, and we don't have phones in these days, and you have to go knock on your friend's door and all that stuff. I do love that.

SPEAKER_03 37:58

Yeah, well, that's that classic meme, isn't it, that you see all the time of uh the last time we were free, and it's a picture of a of a phone with a cable.

SPEAKER_00 38:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:09

So last time we were free was when when phones were tied.

SPEAKER_00 38:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:13

So yeah, I there's definitely, I mean, in terms of I mean it's really interesting getting the two girls on because I think it it's it's all the podcasts we do, they all come back to the same similar themes, which is community and what's around you. And if your community is online on a phone and it's distracting and it's feeding you stuff that isn't that helpful, which most social media is doing. Um I think it is if in any environment where you're trying to improve performance, not having phones is um it's gonna help.

SPEAKER_01 38:53

The the Brit School is my favourite learning place on the planet, and they don't want to be on phones though, they do a weird thing. Hardly anyone, you it would be very rare to see someone on their phone there.

SPEAKER_03 39:05

Yeah, no, where you walk around.

SPEAKER_01 39:06

Otherwise engaged.

SPEAKER_03 39:07

Yeah, yeah. But it's it's the but it's an environmental thing, isn't it? It's almost like the culture is not to be on a phone.

SPEAKER_00 39:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:14

And it's a h it's an unbelievably high performing place. So when you look at performance, I mean I d I I was chatting to JB at Tyler at MD at Tyler Grange about this the other day and thinking could be just could we have the office or somewhere like that where the internet is just blacked out, it doesn't work, where you are where you are working on what you're working on, but it's offline, because you can. I mean, you're working on a report, you're working on dates, whatever it is, you can have access to that. Um, but it's offline. There's no phones, no connection, nothing. I think that would be an incredibly um helpful place to get things done.

SPEAKER_01 39:55

Just call in the 1980s room.

SPEAKER_03 39:57

Yeah, yeah. We could have like what's the sort of famous night of Back to the Future, couldn't we? That was 80s. Back to the Future. Yeah, so we'd I mean there, I think there's Rocky Four Suite. Yeah, Rocky Four Suite, yeah. But there's there's got to be something in that, isn't there? And this idea of hobbies and and have and doing things because I want to do something practical and creative rather than play a sport or play a game or because that feels like I'm competing, doing and what I'd like to do is feel like I'm getting to that flow state where I'm not doing I mean, exercise is great and definitely really important, and I'm not doing enough of it. However, one thing I think I'm really starting to crave is just practically doing stuff because in in lockdown I built a workbench, which is in my shed here, this big workbench thing. I made the top out of wood, glued it all together. I just I had you had loads of extra time on your hands because there was nothing else to do other than be in your own company in your house, and I wasn't going to just watch my garage was so much tighter in lockdown. Is that but is that a mindful activity type of guy? Yeah, I know. So you kind of enjoy it, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:05

However, now it's just like it's a shit show, quite frankly.

SPEAKER_03 41:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:09

I was thinking about this the day, the gym had the bike in there, the bike could be pulled outside. It didn't you didn't have to remove 25 other things in order to do it. You know, you you you you could do the bench press without having to have your leg resting on a lampshade or yeah, it's yeah, it's yeah. We're busy, like that's the reality, isn't it? Yeah, but that's we're not busy, we're yeah, no, no, no. Um I'm I mean generally when I say we, I mean like the human race.

SPEAKER_03 41:36

Yeah, yeah. No, but uh, do you think it's a choice?

SPEAKER_01 41:38

I mean you Yeah, and at the same time, it's a necessity at the moment, isn't it? Because obviously like people are stressed about their jobs or you know, or incomes or all those type of things. It is currently as we do, it's about two pounds for a litre of diesel at this moment in time.

SPEAKER_03 41:56

Yeah, that's scary.

SPEAKER_01 41:58

You will be gloating with your electric car.

SPEAKER_03 42:00

Yeah, I've got an electric car which is making me feel pretty good about that. Um, I feel terrible there about the impact of that. I mean, it's not just fuel prices either, it's just it affects everything. Food, I mean the price of food's gonna go.

SPEAKER_01 42:12

And then you go to Italy or Portugal, like, you know, in Laquilla, like it's it's way cheaper.

SPEAKER_03 42:19

Yeah, well, let's not get into politics because we're gonna be here way too long. But I just I mean, did you what did you take out of chatting with our wives? Is there any I mean you you've made extensive notes, I can see, as like a lot of does that mean my wife need to find uh I mean I love skiing, she hates it.

SPEAKER_01 42:34

Uh we have to have been doing quite a few things together recently that she was she said to me the other week, oh we should do more stuff together. And I think your empty nesting stuff, you've yeah, you've got to find some stuff to do together and some stuff to do apart.

SPEAKER_03 42:46

So definitely. I mean, I I think I I'm just craving some uh empty time, if that makes sense. Where I'm bored. I think I think I think I'm gonna try and create some time where I'm just bored. Yeah. Because I'm gonna have to do something and I'm gonna try and do that in a way that means I don't just watch a film or watch TV or pick up my phone, but actually go, right, I'm not, no screen.

SPEAKER_01 43:11

You can come and help Elsa with a maths revision if you want.

SPEAKER_03 43:14

Okay, I don't think Elsa would do very well doing maths revision with Simon. I'm not sure how much I'd help her.

SPEAKER_01 43:20

Yeah, maybe, maybe. Again, I was thinking about this the other day. So Fred's 21. You know, if he was to work till what's retirement age now, like 70?

SPEAKER_03 43:30

Well uh 57, isn't it? Is is when he can do your state pension.

SPEAKER_01 43:35

It's not states, no, that's if you've got a personal pension. I think state pensions a bit older, maybe let's say let's call it 60. Let's call it 61 from from my math and better.

SPEAKER_03 43:45

I have no idea.

SPEAKER_01 43:46

But I mean, if Fred was going to work uh nine to five forty a week for the next 40 years of his life, that's quite a scary thing to think about, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 43:57

Well, it depends what you do and what it depends what you do.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

But there's lots of people that haven't found purpose or they don't they're not part of a four-day week or they give some time or they don't work in a school that gives them holidays and time to Yeah, I just I was thinking a lot about it and I'm lucky that I live what I do. You're lucky that you love what you do.

SPEAKER_03 44:15

I was Jenny and I wouldn't uh we mentioned this, we were in the pub, our local pub, and there was a couple there. Um don't know them all that well, they're fairly new to the village and but we've chatted a few times. Turns out that they met in Shar Mal Sheikh when they were both diving instructors. Oh yeah. And you would I mean genuinely would never have you know if you've given me a thousand guesses, I probably wouldn't have got to driving and diving instructor. Um don't know why. I mean they'd but uh but um she was doing a job working for a company, they really, really liked her, and it was a good, really good employer. They said, Okay, we can have a year off, go and do what you like, you've been here for a certain amount of time, take a year out, and we'll keep your job for you, which I thought was pretty cool. And this is a this is a while ago. That's that's quite a cool company, and so she just she packed a job in and went off to teach diving in Sharm al Sheikh, and ended up staying there for for five years a future husband. Um, you know, when you when you talk about you know, you've got to get on the on the treadmill on the hamster wheel of of careers and things, it's it's kind of frightening to get off it, isn't it? But I think she took the courage to get off it and go and do something she really wanted.

SPEAKER_01 45:24

It's almost impossible. I mean, lots of my friends are still stuck on the treadmill, and then I was thinking, I might went for breakfast with a hockey coach this morning, and they'd been bought by private equity of their company, and it's changed everything. Oh, I bet that's bad. Yeah, it's changed everything. People lost their jobs, and anyway, it was uh yeah, you that's just the reality, isn't it? Of like so for Fred at the moment, he's gonna go to Canada next year. You know, can he have amazing experiences? Can he, you know, learn some stuff along the way? And then I was with Twiggy, who'd done his knee and actually like this view of the world. He said, Look, I've I've done pretty well from my work. So if my son decides he wants to do something that's meaningful, like be a primary school teacher or be a nurse or a doctor or whatever, and it doesn't pay well enough, then I will subsidize that. And I like that view of the world because often they are like, Okay, you've got to earn this amount of money. Well, I've got to go and get a job in the city, and then I'm not working nine to five, I'm working, you know, 18 hour days, and life disappears quickly.

SPEAKER_03 46:27

We both know a lot of people in the city. I mean, I don't know anyone who does that who I would say has found the secret. I mean, they've all got loads of money, but their lives aren't necessarily the best.

SPEAKER_00 46:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:41

I mean, I'm sure there are people that that are absolutely smashing it in that world, but uh but I haven't met many. It's uh I don't know the secret to life, it's not cash, is it? I don't know. In and in but if you I mean we try try and keep ourselves on topic here, Asty. We're you know, we're talking about resilience and and creating um bounce back ability and people having the capacity to cope with stuff, it's gotta be get off phones and do something be bought be bored, I think. I mean I I think you know w when you talk to Jenny about her school porn, she hasn't really changed. I think that's all of us. Do you change fundamentally? I don't think you do.

SPEAKER_01 47:27

Um so I don't know, I've got a little bit uh more empathetic, so that's helpful.

SPEAKER_03 47:32

Well she said you've become really soft. How hard were you? Were you a critically horrible person?

SPEAKER_01 47:39

No, not at all really. Maybe when I was playing rugby. Maybe I thought I was. Yeah, maybe.

SPEAKER_03 47:47

When we were young and dumb.

SPEAKER_00 47:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 47:49

I mean that's part of growing up, isn't it? You start realising what the world's really about. You've got to experience and see what's going on to get there, haven't you? We've all been there. I certainly have. Um well I hope everybody enjoyed the our special the ones with the the one with the wives. The one with the wives.

SPEAKER_01 48:05

Because I've um current wives, current wives, if true dreams continue at the rate they're going, this could be Yes, if they keep dreams divorce.

SPEAKER_03 48:15

Yeah, uh madness. Um, but yeah, I hope you all enjoyed it and uh yeah, we'll see you next time.

SPEAKER_01 48:21

Over and out. Thanks so much for joining us on the Ban Specability Podcast with Samuel Russell. We've really enjoyed your company. If you want to reach out to us, Simon, where can they reach you up?

SPEAKER_03 48:31

Um LinkedIn's best place, Simon Ursul, U R S for Sugar E L L. Send me a message. Rusty, where can we find you?

SPEAKER_01 48:38

TikTok? No, not really. LinkedIn, Russell and Sure. And then the same on Twitter, but please uh ignore all my political thoughts.

SPEAKER_03 48:46

Yeah, second that.

SPEAKER_01 48:47

Over and out.